To lie or not to lie

[willspal]

that is my big question.

We have for the first time ever booked our summer hols for the 12th July (school finishes on the 21st)

Its all booked and paid for and the Primary school does not have a problem with my 5 year old taking the last week and a bit off BUT I have heard that my Sons Secondary school (he is 14) might not be so easy going.

Its a school that is oversubscribed and we are out of the catchment area and struggled to get him a place.

I have heard that they 'could' sanction the holiday but then inform us on our return he has lost his place and we would have to look for another school which is a big no no for me.

We only booked the hols for this date as he has done his Year 9 Sats and we always see the last week of term wasted with them sat around watching videos so I did not think he would be missing that much.

Do I lie and just ring up the morning we go away and say he has got cronic heyfever (which he does suffer very badly from and the school and Docs know this) or do I be open and honest now and take a massive risk. Have to admit I am more in favour of lying as scared stiff he will loose his place but I always feel you get found out lying and then you look even worse.

What would anyone else do.

WP

[JudgeJ]

I don�t normally get involved with protracted threads, especially those which are matters of opinion. However, I feel I need to reply to some of the points raised, as this is a matter on which I hold particularly strong views.

Yes, Helion, I am being judgemental (just look at my AB name!). There is nothing wrong with this. When questions such as this are posed there is no �correct� answer and many responses will be made in accordance with the individual�s judgement.

I�m glad you like some of my postings, gessoo. I try to be constructive. I am not criticising willspal personally. She is clearly doing what she thinks is the best for her husband and children. Unfortunately she has been sucked into the popular culture which prevails at the moment, and it is upon this which my comments are based, not her personal actions.

On some of the specific points:

Yes teachers� absenteeism is unacceptably high in some places. This should not be compounded by pupils being unnecessarily absent as well. If both continue to rise, the two parties may never meet!

Yes, education is so much more than schooling. That is why the children are given 12 to 14 weeks holiday each year and assorted school trips during term time.

Contrary to what you suggest, gesso �authorised� absences are lower in fee paying schools. There are plenty of figures to support this. There are a number of reasons why this should be so and I have picked on just a couple which I fell are relevant to this argument. You will find that many of their prospectuses state specifically that leave of absence in term time is not normally granted for family holidays.

[Continued]

[JudgeJ]

[Continued]

Yes they do have to keep the fees coming in. They have this in mind when making their policies. If their performance drops (as they clearly think it will if the level of absence is allowed to increase) word soon gets round, and next year�s fees may be harder to come by..

Many people who send their children to fee paying schools are not rich. They often make quite big sacrifices to be able to do so, including (ironically) taking fewer or less expensive holidays. Unlike parents of state school pupils, they are able to calculate exactly the financial cost of two weeks of their child�s education and this undoubtedly influences their decisions.

I am well aware of the different types of truancy or absence and know they do not all have the same effect on the child�s education. My point, however, is that you cannot condemn one type of absence whilst condoning (or �authorising�) another. Children see their classmates as absent, whether authorised or not. They then return and tell their friends what a nice holiday they�ve had whilst their classmates were slaving over a desk.

[Continued]

[JudgeJ]

I stand by what I said about some (not all) parents not considering the profound effect that having children will have on their lives. This is just one of many changes which seemingly take them by surprise after they become parents, and for which they expect dispensation.

The comments about the cost of holidays fall into the same category. It is not a recent phenomenon for holiday companies to charge less during school term time; it has been thus almost as long as there have been holiday companies.

So, back to you willspal. I never seriously expected you to take my advice from my first post. I was more interested to see the �views of the nation� on this topic as well, of course, expressing mine. I�m really glad you�ve decided to be truthful about this with the Head � it�s always best to come clean. I�m sure everything will be OK and you and your family will have a great and well deserved holiday. Make sure they�re back in school on the first day of the new term, though!!!

[gessoo]

Hi JudgeJ. I take all your points. I must admit I hadn't researched enough your points about fee paying schools because I only used evidence from the one I have very close links with ;o).

However, being a lady who thought very carefully about having children, considered the effects it would have on my life, knew that things would have to be sacrifices and that children must take priority for years and years ad infinitum (I was 35 when I had my child by the way) I can honestly say that the question of whether I would be prepared to take holidays during school holidays never entered my head.

[gessoo]

I did make sacrifices for my child's education JudgeJ, including paying fees! Plus all the other hidden costs that were not included. I am very far from being rich. I worked purely to finance his education!!

[JudgeJ]

It seems, despite our earlier differences, we may be of like mind after all, gessoo!

Parents paying �3,000 per term (not unusually high for a day pupil these days) for their child to attend school realise that each day costs them about �50. The child takes two weeks off and that�s �500 worth of education gone west. The cost per pupil at state schools is probably not much different, but the parents do not make the same calculation.

Your experience of working hard just to pay for your child�s education is by no means unusual. It illustrates one of my points precisely and it dispels the popular misconception that pupils at fee paying schools all have parents who are rich. The tragedy (or scandal, as I prefer to call it) is that so many parents like you have to make enormous sacrifices to provide their children with a decent education. Many feel unable to rely on the state scheme to which they have been forced to contribute huge sums via their taxes.

Education chiefs cite many reasons why state schools do not, generally, reach the same level of achievement as fee-paying schools. Indeed there are many reasons. But so long as such schools allow their pupils (and their teachers) to be unnecessarily absent in a haphazard fashion, they will always struggle to succeed. I think we�d better put this one to bed!

[gedk]

If I were you Willspal I would politely inform the school head of your intention to take your son on holiday at a time that suits you. I doubt very much whether they could get away with taking away his place just because he missed the last week of term. It really annoys me when schools think they can tell parents what they can and can't do with their own children. If the head is funny with you do what one of the other posters suggested and ask for a breakdown of exactly what work your son would be doing during the last week of term and if this week is so important ask why previous last weeks of term have been spent watching DVDs.

Good luck in your dealings with the school, and remember your are in charge of your son's life not the school/head!!

[eyore]

if it was me i would lie i am a parent with the same problem but i was honest and it back fired not allowed time from school so go on holiday enjoy and do not worry

[queenzombie]

I had the same dilemma in may, I wrote to both of my sons schools and told them the truth (my parents live abroad, they dont get to see them often and also it was the first year anniversary of their granpas death in between my eldests birthday and his nans)

I know I probably had a little more to go on than you but still I believe honesty is the best policy.

Just make sure you write to them, the primary school will probably ask you to sign a school form as they did with me. I received a letter from my eldests school agreeing to the request but then also stating not to do it again!

Good luck and have a fab holiday x

[Lore]

Be honest, apply for leave of absence, schools have holiday forms. Explain that it's the only time you can take due to work commitments.
If your son has a good attendance, there shouldn't be a problem.

Believe me, the amount of children at my place of work who drop their parents straight in upon their return to school is beyond belief!

The biggest risk is a possible fine, which both you and your partner would have to pay each per child if the holiday leave isn't granted.