moving abroad

[frogdancer]

my partner and i want to move to france with my 13 year old daughter from a previous relationship. she visits her dad every fortnight but there is no parent/child relationship and generally her dad is working when she stays over so is looked after reluctantly by her stepmother... My daughter wants to make the move too, as the relationship with her dad isnt a great one - but knows her dad wont allow it.. Where do we stand on the issue of moving, and what age can my daughter decide where she wants to be? any advice appreciated.

[shanilisa]

I am in a similar situation in that I want to relocate to the UK from SA and know that my ex won't be happy to allow me to leave with our son who is 3.

In SA a child can now have a say as to which parent he/she wants to live with at age 7 and this will be taken into consideration by the court. At 13, what the child requests will generally be granted.

Here if you can make a case for a "better lifestyle in the benefit of the child in another country" then the court will generally rule in your favour to leave the country.

Good luck!

[Buenchico]

Under the provisions of the Child Abduction Act 1984, if your daughter's father has parental responsibility you can't take your daughter out of the country without his permission. The only exception is that, if you've got a residence order, you can take her out of the country for a maximum period of one month at a time.

If her father does not have parental responsibility you're free to take your daughter abroad (for an unlimited period) without his permission.

Your daughter was born before the date when her father would have automatically gained parental responsibility by jointly registering her birth with you. So he will only have parental responsibility if:
(a) you were married to him at the time of your daughter's birth ; or
(b) you've entered into a formal parental responsibility agreement with him ; or
(c) a court has granted him a parental responsibility order.

If he does not currently have parental responsibility, he can still apply for it, through the courts. The criteria used in assessing such an application are summarised in this link:
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Parents/ParentsRig hts/DG_4002954

Confirmation of the rules imposed by the Child Abduction Act can be found here:
http://www.ips.gov.uk/passport/apply-child-rul es-parental-responsibility-rules.asp

At 16 years old all young people have the right to walk out of the family home and, if they so choose, never to have any contact with their parents again. (If their parents reported them as missing, and the police located them, the police would be barred from revealing the young person's location to their parents). So it follows that your daughter will be free to

[Buenchico]

. . decide who to live with when she becomes 16.

Chris

[frogdancer]

thanks all..especially buenchico.always know your stuff!!! just answer me this - a simple yes/no based on my criteria.. 1. i was never married to the father
2. a formal parental responsibility order??? we arranged visitation when we parted ways thats it....
3. solicitor involvement in past due to passing up his responsibilities and leaving our child overnight at a family home unknown to our daughter. many other factors such as no parental interaction or involvement, putting himself first...ie going to pub etc.... and other factors which i cannot go into which i hope would make my case more substantial.

[Buenchico]

Thanks for the reply, Frogdancer.

As I read your post, your daughter's father definitely does not currently have parental responsibility.

As previously stated, he retains the right to apply for parental responsibility, but that doesn't mean that a court would actually grant it. Looking at the link I provided above, he'd not score very well against the 'commitment' or 'attachment' criteria. The court might be influenced by his 'reason for applying' for the order (i.e. that he didn't want his daughter to live abroad, where he'd be unable to see her very often) but it's unclear whether that would carry sufficient weight.

(I'm a bit out of my depth here. I know what the rules state but the proceedings of family courts are confidential, so it's hard to accurately assess how a court would view his application).

In practice it might be best to keep your plans secret from your former partner as long as possible, so that he'll have insufficient time to seek a court order before you emigrate. (The only problem with that course of action, though, is that your former partner could still obtain a court order after your departure. If you returned to the UK, even for a holiday, he could then exercise his right to refuse you permission to take your daughter out of the country again).

Oops! You wanted a simple yes/no answer.
Sorry, I was never very good at pr�cis!

Chris

PS: I'm assuming that your daughter must speak good French, or that you've got the funds to pay for her to be privately educated, in an English-speaking school. Otherwise I'm forced to ask whether you've seriously considered her education.

[frogdancer]

thanks again buenchico - its good to know that some people have incredible insight when i couldnt get the answers directly from family legal phonecalls!! Your answer again seems what i originally thought - and as you say all is done at the discretion of the judge - each case is different... i just want a better quality of life for my daughter.. her stepfather is french, and our new baby son will be taught in both languages.. we are in a position to enable both children to receive whatever education they should need. thanks again - will look out for you again i guess!!