Oliver Cromwell

[KittyGirl]

does anyone acctually like oliver cromwell? coz i sure dont , i mean do u think he was a good or bad man?

[Catso]

Like everyone else in the world, he was good and bad. He did what he honestly believed was right at the time, but the benefit of hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Personally, on balance, I would say he did more good in the world than bad, but I admit he did do some dreadful things.

[Lou Knee]

Ollie had a brill idea but unfortunately a load of twerps a few years later reversed it.........shame

[yassa]

He was just misunderstood, just like Vlad de teppes.

[noxlumos]

Well people from our neck of the woods often don't appreciate his "subtle beauty" do we? With bl**dy good reason I might add. This cartoon sums up exactly how I feel about Oliver Cromwell...
http://www.langerland.com/content/view/37/59/

[Lonnie]

A good link nox, I was going to say, ask the Irish if he was good or bad?,

totally evil to the Irish, but needed in England at the time, he had no need to cross the water, least of all to do what he did once he got there.

[chimney]

Backing up Lonnie, Cromwell had the right ideas for england but did not have the the best interests for britain as a whole, you could argue that cromwell was the first modern day fascist

[raysparx1]

When he started out I believe he thought he was doing the right thing for his Country, When I was at School I thought he was wonderful, then when I looked into a bit deeper,and read of the things that happened in Ireland, it made me think again, I still admire the way he stood by what he believed in though, He was a very strong willed man.

[raysparx1]

If I remember correctly what he did in Ireland was A real Panic measure his popularity in England was Fading rapidly,so sending the Bored troops out to Ireland to Kill some Catholics,to him was a real popularity booster, and for a little while it worked, Nox please correct me if I have got that bit wrong, Ray

[KebabMeister]

After he died, wasn't he dug up, hung, drawn & quartered?

[raysparx1]

Yes Kebab, when Charles 1 son Chales 2 came back from exile from France (I think it was France) He had the Body dug up a Quartered I think the Head was put on a pikestaff in Parliament square, but I might be getting a bit mixed up with the facts here, please somebody correct if I am

[noxlumos]

You're pretty much spot on Ray. He was responsible both directly in some cases and indirectly in others for the destruction of 1/3 of the entire poopulation of Ireland, either by simple murder, eviction and starvation or the selling of Catholics into slavery and sending them to the West Indies. That is a feat of genocidal warfare that has never been anything like equalled in Ireland since and it does put the t*sser into a bit of perspective.Lol
His head was stuck on a spike after he was exhumed and posthumously executed on the anniversay of the execution of Charles I and then bizarrely his head kept changing hands, being displayed here there and everywhere until finally his old college got hold of it and buried it at Sidney Sussex college in Cambridge.That part always fascinated me when I was a kid, lol , probably gave me my great love of history, the fact it was so intererstingly ghoulish to a 6 year old :)

[raysparx1]

Thanks Nox, the only thing I can say in his Favour is,he was probably one of the greatest Generals ever,even when faced with defeat,he turned it round and was victorius, If his Son Richard had been as astute,would things have changed forever ? I don't think Charles the second would have got back here if he had been,but Richard was a bit of a bufoon, Fascinating subject Nox, I used to do Jobs for Lady Antonia Fraser, and I used to pick her brains a bit,god that woman has got some knowledge of History.

[raysparx1]

Also Nox, When the body was exhumed didn't it hang at Tyburn for a while before the beheading, thinking on,I don't think he was Quartered was he ? just beheaded ? please let me know , Ray

[KittyGirl]

well I AM irish, so thats why i was asking, thanks 4 ur reviews tho

<3 muchluv <3

=^.^=

[KittyGirl]

he also burned down a church with people inside it in drogheda, and he put all the survivors in a line, killed every tenth one, and then sent the rest of them to the carribean islands

[raysparx1]

Hi Kitty, It is a good question, most English haven't much time for him either, he would have been a real hero,if he had just stayed within England. Ray

[KittyGirl]

thats very true, my history teacher thinks it may have been back then where the "Troubles" started, but im not sure. hmmm, maybe that was too long ago, what do you think ray?

[KittyGirl]

WAIT! U WORKED FOR LADY A. FRASER?????? thats soooo cool! she was the one who wrote the most famous biography of Cromwell, like ever!

[raysparx1]

HI Kitty,

I think you are correct, he hated catholics,hence the taking over of Parliament here, But I believe,I may be wrong,that he came over to Ireland because his popularity here was going,so he let the troops do whatever they wanted, ie, Kill as many Catholics as you like, it boosted his popularity here for a while, we must remember most English then were very simple people and believed that all Catholics were enemies, Crazy world eh, the sad thing is, it's not getting any better worldwide is it !

Yes I used to work in Kensington,just round the corner from where she lives, I did jobs for her for many years, she is a very Knowledgeable lady, Ray

[KittyGirl]

it is sad, but its starting to clear up in areas, its hard to believe that places like Derry used to be a protestant refuge! and now look at it!
At least it's all in the past now, but its such an interesting debate topic! thanks for ur answers everyone i appreciate them very much!

<3 muchluv <3

=^.^=