Electrical Question

[wolf63]

An electrician has checked the wiring i in my flat and told me that the lights circuit is not earthed. He tried to find he problem but he thinks that the problem is under the floorboards. There is no access to it as the floor is laminated.

The solution has been to leave the circuit unearthed. The problem areas are the hallway and two bedrooms. He told me o purchase pendant lights for these rooms.

Will any pendant do or will I have to buy a special no-metal type?

I know that I could contact the electrician but this is a better place to ask.

[Zacs-Master]

You haven’t said what the original problem is.

[klazomaniac]

He has told you to buy (Plastic) pendants to eliminate the possibility of electric shock under fault conditions.

It does not make the circuit safe though. There will be no earth to the switches also if the installation is loop in / loop out or Junction box type. Therefore the back boxes to the switches will be unearthed. This leaves the 3.5mm screws holding the switch plate on unearthed.

It would also fail an EICR (Electrical installation condition report) should you need one. E.G Selling your house or insurance purposes.

I'm a quallified Electrician. And the only advise I can give is to have it remediated. But the choice is yours (cost and damage to decoration).

[klazomaniac]

Please omit 'Also'

switches (also) if the installation

[klazomaniac]

The thing that strikes me odd is ''but he thinks that the problem is under the floorboards''

Obviously I cannot see the layout of your flat.

But most Flats either have concrete ceilings (where your wiring will be run under the floor [a void] of the upstairs apartment)

Or

Plasterboard ceilings (where again the wires will come from above that. Access to an upstairs flat maybe required)

Why would the wires go under the floor to go up to the ceiling ??

Maybe get a second opinion.

[wolf63]

I think that the problem is that the lounge flor is a couple of inches above the rest.

It has a laminated floor and then over that there is a raised laminated floor. Getting all that up will cost much time and money.
At this stage I am not able to get it done. Perhaps next year!

I just want to confirm that pendants are usually metal free.

He has installed extra sockets for me and new fuse board things.

[wolf63]

Zacs - there wasn't a problem as such. I am moving into the flat next week and the survey suggested having the electrics checked.

[klazomaniac]

Definitely go PLASTIC [insulated] with a nice lampshade.

I understand the implications of ruining your decoration. Tell him to replace the switches with (plastic insert) covers. [link below] This will reduce the possibility of 'Direct contact' if a fault does develop.

Sorry to have had to say what I did. But I have a duty to give you the correct advise.

https://www.screwfix.com/p/mk-base-10ax-1-gang-2-way-light-switch-white/497PF?kpid=497PF&ds_rl=1249401&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI2YrsldWE_gIVxfd3Ch26HwQjEAQYASABEgJ2ZvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

[Zacs-Master]

You don’t need an Earth on a lighting circuit
https://www.mybuilder.com/questions/v/1206/is-it-essential-to-have-an-earth-on-my-lighting-circuit-i-am-planning-to-rent-the-property-out

I’d suggest getting a report by someone who knows what they are talking about.

[Buenchico]

Look for 'Class 2' (double-insulated) lights.

e.g. https://www.thelightingsuperstore.co.uk/class-2-double-insulated/ceiling-lights
or
https://www.lightingcompany.co.uk/ceiling-lights-c3/double-insulated-lights-class11-c31

[klazomaniac]

Zacs. Look at the date on your link.
We are currently under BS7671 2018 (18th Edition)

2010 come under the 16th Edition (2 Editions ago !) Rules and Regs change.

Chris, Class ii equipment is double insulated (Generally plastic) Not requiring an earth. But the circuit under BS7671 2018 (i8th Edition) States that an earth is required.

[Zacs-Master]

I bow to your superior knowledge of the IEE regs

[klazomaniac]

I'm not trying to be clever Zacs. I'm a fully quallified Electrical engineer (Still my occupation to date)

I'm just giving Wolf the correct information.

I have had this scenario myself with a client some time ago.
I can only advise.

Wolf's decision at the end of the day. And Wolf is free to take yours and Chris's advice also.

I'm just speaking from experience (It's my trade)

[Zacs-Master]

Did I say you were trying to be clever?

[royfromaus]

No earth or faulty earth?

Hard to believe that twin and earth wasn't used.

[klazomaniac]

No you didn't Zacs. I was just explaining that I wasn't trying to be.
This thread reminded me of something I posted a long time ago.

https://www.theanswerbank.co.uk/ChatterBank/Question1654249.html

It got quite a few comments (including some witty responces from yourself.

royfromaus, The circuit will have been wired in twin and earth (the electrical tester has a duty to inform the client if not)
And as the Wolf has stated 'The problem areas are the hallway and two bedroom' (Other points are ok) Therefore the circuit has lost its earth (cpc) along the way. (usually at a junction box hidden in the void) as the cables don't go direct to the fittings.

[wolf63]

So, it is best to have the three lights earthed. But it is not essential.

Is it likely that the electrician didn't think to put plastic covers in the switches? Will he have automatically done this?

The problem here is that I don't really understand how electrics etc works. Is the earth wire the only safety measure or will heir be a backup? Double Redundancy?

The reason that females make up only 5% of electricians has to reflect that it is something that we have no interest in or inclination for. :-)

I will purchase my light pendants wisely.I

Thanks to all of you. My next question may be "how do you cat-proof ornaments"?

[1ozzy]

A tried and proven method.

https://ibb.co/2gz9FKn

[wolf63]

I might try that. :-)

It will be a new moggie and I can only hope that he doesn't toss things off shelves.

My profile picture enjoyed killing ornaments!

[Ryzen]

If the cpc is not continuous up to the fittings get it rectified.Meanwhile you must install class 2 fittings where any conductive parts are accessible.This is irrespective of any RCD/RCBO being used as upstream protection.PS..klaz knows what he's talking about!!