Disciplinary Meeting

[Boriyako]

I work as a salaried driver for a small charity organisation.

I was informed this evening by my line manager that he "needs to meet with me before work starts tomorrow".

I asked why and could we not talk now. He replied that he could not say anything else now as he needs to meet with one of the shop managers prior to our meeting.

Some background:

The organisation has 16 shops in London, each with a Manager. The 6 or 7 top performing shops have managers who I get on with well. The rest of the shops have various problems which Management are well aware of. Some of these shops have managers who object to the fact that I will for example, query why they are sending/rotating stock that is clearly not saleable, thus simply transferring a problem rather than dealing with it. Their attitude towards me is one of "who is this person, a mere driver, to query actions?" I must stress that I do this in a non-confrontational way (I hope so, as this not my intention. I query these sort of actions because they cost the organisation financially. Frustratingly, Management are aware of this behaviour but do nothing. They do not like the fact that I raise these matters. The impression I have had in the past is that they would rather just ignore these problems and are impatient with my raising them)

My question is - what rights do I have going into this meeting? It is clearly some form of disciplinary scenario and I have no idea what I can or cannot ask for in terms of defending myself in the event that I am accused of something of which I am not guilty. If I have done/said something wrong I am prepared to "take it on the chin" but I will not sit back and let them harass me.

Any advice would be gratefully appreciated

Thank you
Miles

[woofgang]

Who has told you its a disciplinary meeting?

[pixie373]

It sounds as though it could be, if you are upsetting managers. Is it part of your job to advise them? Do you know all the background details and rules they have. Just going by your post, you seem to think yourself that you aren't behaving appropriately?

[Eve]

ACAS have some advice resources:

http://www.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=1364

Keep a written log of everything. Are you in a Trade Union?

[chelle7272]

You're entitled to union representation if you are in one, or a colleague to accompany you. As a charity they should have a formal disciplinary policy and procedure accessible to all staff. You can ask that you have an opportunity to see it first if you haven't already. If it a disciplinary you have a right to respond to any allegations, but if you are not accompanied and arent aware of the policy ask for a second meeting to be arranged to give you time to find out where you stand.
if you have acted outside of your job description I'd recommend accepting that it was inappropriate and say you'll refrain from doing it in future.

[Boriyako]

Thank you for your answers. No-one has told me it is a disciplinary meeting - reading between the lines, body language, tone of voice and general attitude led me to this (admittedly) assumption.

If it is inappropriate to point out that money is being lost by sheer inefficiency, then I will have to accept that. But my own beliefs and standards prevent me from not speaking up.

Thank you for the ACAS link.

I am not a member of any union.

I seem to remember being shown a document when I first joined them 18 months ago, where disciplinary procedures were mentioned. I will certainly, if necessary, ask for this.

Based on what your kind answers, and my own thoughts, I will attend the meeting and if it is anything more than an easily resolved minor matter , I will ask for the matter to be put to me in writing so that I can consider my options and take appropriate actions.

Thanks again

[Taff123]

You are fully entitled to have someone sit in the meeting with you to be a witness to everything that is said. You are also entitled to a copy of any minutes that are taken. Don't forget, bullying and harassment are frowned upon by a tribunal board and the court of human rights. I should also think that disclosure has to be given as to the nature of the meeting and submitted in good time.

[Boriyako]

Divebuddy - thanks for taking the time to answer. Refer to the last part of my question - I ahve repeatedly informed my line manager of the problems. I have no-one other than the CEO to escalate the matters to. The CEO is well aware of my attempts to inform Management of the problems.

2 examples of what else I do that "annoys" some Managers.

1 particular manager was referring to me when talking to their shop staff as "the driver". I politely (STRESS politely) asked her not to do that as she is well aware of my name. She called my manager and said I was "cheeky"

Another Manager complained to me that one of the staff at head office was not providing him with essential office requisites on occasion. I told him that that person had a huge workload (it is a very small staff) and sometimes forgot/missed things and that it would be better to give a list to me and I would make sure she got it. The shop manager reported this and accused me of saying that the staff member was inefficient - not true. (this was resolved when I explained to Management exactly what had been said)

[Maydup]

If this is a discp meeting it would have been put in writing setting out the issues. Since it isn't try to take the sting out of it by not reacting too agressively. How about being the laid back Miles just this time and saying you're sorry if you've wound anyone up, didn't mean it. Leave it at that and don't let them wind you up.

[Boriyako]

Thank you Maydup. You've brought me down. You're right. Go in, be cool, no aggression........however, if they want to play hard, lets go!!

[EDDIE51]

You are jumping to conclusions here , this may be just an informal discussion as far as you know. By law you MUST be informed if you are being subject to a formal disciplinary procedure. You also must have had verbal and written warnings before the formal disciplinary hearing, unless the offence is one of 'gross misconduct' which this clearly isn't.
Come back to us when you have had the meeting and give more information

[EDDIE51]

I agree with Maidup, you come across as aggressive and confrontational .
You need to be more relaxed yet positive.
Years ago i went on an assertiveness course , it was one of the best courses i have ever been on and taught me a lot.
I think you would benefit from learning to be assertive rather than the confrontational approach you seem to demonstrate in this thread.

[Peter Pedant]

Hi Miles - good luck - if you have been employed for longer than 2y then they cannot summarily lay you off - they can if it is less.

Take a work colleague - I think the ACAS link says the results are much better.

and yes if they have a disciplinary code they have to show you a copy (s6 of the employment act) and they have to follow it.
There is no requirement to have one (but if they do they must make it available)

Wht you have been doing is acting in the firms best interests

You can call this the beneficent duty of the employee
you have a duty to do this (point out fraud etc)
and they cant discipline you for doing so

and good luck !

PP

[factor-fiction]

Yes, I think PP has identified a key point here. If you have not worked there very long they can dismiss you for almost any reason (barring things like gender, race, membership of union). How long have you been employed by this company on a continuous basis?

[Peter Pedant]

Also in the meeting you may not be able to answer all the questions

so tell them ! - that you asked for an agenda - taht is you wanted to know what the meeting was about and the managers declined to tell you.

you have nt had a chance to prepare so it is not possible to answer XYZ but yo could have done if you have been given notice.

I agree this smells like a surprise disciplinaty .....

keep your temper - answer the questions - you cant plead the 5th amendment because it isnt a criminal investigation

and try not to mention harassment at the first meeting....

[factor-fiction]

It probably is a prelude to a disciplinary process but it could be something else- the start of a regular feedback/appraisal process, notification of potential restructuring or redundancy, a discussion about a new role. Let us know how you get on.

[Boriyako]

Thank you so much everyone for taking time out to reply to me.

You all restore some of my slightly tarnished faith in humanity!

My "aggression" comes from seeing so much money wasted, money that should be going to Great Ormond Street and all the other charities we "support" So, to me, it's a kind of righteous anger. (fear the righteous man for he is a fool on a mission"!!

I know that an aggressive approach is always counterproductive, but sometimes I can't help it. Damn!

So... I go to bed now, determined to at least try and be calm and non-confrontational tomorrow. All thanks to you folks.

Gratias

[Boriyako]

Unfortunately I have only worked for them for 18 months. Tough. I'll play it as it comes. Cheers. goodnight.

[cassa333]

I hope your meeting goes well and I can't add any legal view but wanted to say that rahter than keep bringing up the waste with the managers that are the cause you would be better off talking to those that you get on with and have to deal with the scraps that should go to the rag man.

Although I think within a charity or any business everyone should be able to make these sort of comments about waste and bad practice human nature means some will be offended by their failings being pointed out.

Set the bomb timer with occational comments and leave it to those that can have more of an impact. If nothing happens then why would anyone think their comments would have more impact than that of higher up managers?

If there are enough managers that think you are a moaning interfereing driver then that is something that will stick, regardless of those that think you are OK As the old saying goes... Mud Sticks