Taking Iver A Lease.

[horseshoes]

Advice please.

My friend and I are hoping to have a little gift shop which we went to view today. The chap who has the lease at present, sustained an injury which means he can no longer carry on his business which was a fruit and vegetable shop. He carried out about £3k of repairs to the property with permission from the landlord. We saw before and after photos and to be fair, there is a massive improvement. The rent is nice and low and rather than increase that, he is asking for £1,200 as a contribution to the improvements, although this came as a bit of a shock to us! My questions are these.....

1) is that a reasonable request?
2) are we able to taken on his lease without the landlord knowing (he says the ladlord is happy for him to pass onnthe lease to someone else.
3) if we do takeon the lease, should we involve a solicitor?

Thank you.

[Buenchico]

It's up to the freeholder to reassign the lease (and to determine the rent). If, as your post suggests, you'd be paying rent to the current leaseholder then
(a)the lease would still have to be in his name ; and
(b) he'd then be 'sub-letting'.
Since the vast majority of leases prohibit sub-letting, it sounds like a very dodgy arrangement to me.

[woofgang]

I'd definitely want proof that the freeholder knows what is happening and is ok with it

[ToraToraTora]

don't do it like that.

[Peter Pedant]

I dont think you are taking on the lease TBH

as above - I think you are being sublet to
and you need to find out whether you have security which you can only do by looking at the head lease ( his)

the result is - he mitigates his loss ( or gets some return on his investment )
and you get a place to trade in - from time to time and with no security

deal is OK for landlord and leaseholder and pretty cerappy for you - so is the rent low enough to compensate ?

[horseshoes]

Thanks all for your replies. We wouldn't be paying our rent to him, but to the landlord. He has already said he definitely doesn't want to sublet. We'd have to speak to the landlord ourselves I think. If and when we do take over the lease, should we involve a solicitor or is a witness enough? I know I (we) sound very naive about this but neither if us have ANY experience in renting or retail. All a bit of an adventure, but we don't want to trip up on our first venture.

Thank you.

[Tilly2]

Good luck with it all, Horseshoes. I hope it's a successful venture for you.

[Peter Pedant]

so who would you be paying the £ 1200 to
and to what end ?

[Peter Pedant]

you dont TAKE over the lease
you sign a new lease with the lease holder

I am a landlord - and a new tenant - new lease
the new tenant doesnt take over anything
I have only charged rent - I have never charged a new tenant for past alterations. This is reflected in the rent.

sof if they go on - taking over a lease
and saying £1200 is involved yes I would see a solicitor

[horseshoes]

Thanks Tilly.

We'd be paying the present leaseholder. He forked out the £3k to do the work, not the landlord. He reckoned it was a better deal as the landlord would have increased the rent if he'd have had to pay for the improvements.

[horseshoes]

Peter Pedant, im using the incorrect terminology, sorry. I think he means that he will sign the lease over to us.

[Tilly2]

Just take care that it is all above board, Horseshoes. Personally, I would ask a solicitor for advice.

[Cloverjo]

TBH, this sounds a bit dodgy, horseshoes. The present leaseholder can't just sign the lease over to you. The landlord has to want to take you on as a new leaseholder.

[Cloverjo]

I've also heard of a landlord who increased the rent after his tenants had improved the place. He actually said 'It's so much nicer, I can charge more rent.' To the same people who had paid for the improvements.
Don't trust anyone.

[horseshoes]

Yes, I think its all very well him saying that the landlord is happy, I think WE need to speak to the landlord to make sure. I'd hate to pay the £1200 AND the rent goes up anyway; and yes to solicitor too.

Thanks all.

[marval]

Whatever you do Horseshoes, I wish you both well in your venture.

[horseshoes]

Thanks Marval. It' s exciting.

[Barmaid]

It's a commercial property lease and those come in many forms. Personally, I wouldnt touch it with a bargepole unless I'd had proper legal advice from a specialist first. What ARE you taking on? How long? Is it a full repairing lease? Seriously I do think you need advice.

[horseshoes]

Hi Barmaid
It's a tiny shop. The rent will be £360 per month plus utilities. I would hope it would be a 12 month lease.

The chap is supposed to get back to us tomorrow. Ill ask him for the
phone number of the landlord so we can speak directly to him.

[Tilly2]

Any update on this, Horseshoes?

[horseshoes]

No Tilly. The chap was SUPPOSED to ring me today, but hasn't! Im meeting my friend tomorrow so we'll decide whether to chase him up or accept that this one wasn't meant to be. I'll update again tomorrow.

It's kind of you to ask. Thank you.