Technology1 min ago
Assange - who are we trying to please?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-19259623
Is it the US or Sweden?
if he does get extradited to Sweden its expected they will hand him over to the US with a possible death penalty being enforced.
Won't we then be accused of rendition?
Is it the US or Sweden?
if he does get extradited to Sweden its expected they will hand him over to the US with a possible death penalty being enforced.
Won't we then be accused of rendition?
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@Ellipsis
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stop being silly !
there cant be many people who seriously believe that Assange wont end up in the USA (thats if he doesnt have an unfortunate accident/illness first !!
Our duty is to not bow down to the USA and do what ever they want whenever they blow their whistle, luckily for now until the EU completely swallows us we are still able to make some decisions for ourselves
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stop being silly !
there cant be many people who seriously believe that Assange wont end up in the USA (thats if he doesnt have an unfortunate accident/illness first !!
Our duty is to not bow down to the USA and do what ever they want whenever they blow their whistle, luckily for now until the EU completely swallows us we are still able to make some decisions for ourselves
We're not being asked to extradite him to the US. We're being asked to extradite him to Sweden, and our own legal process has already agreed to do this - it was then that he jumped bail! The law needs to take its due process with Assange.
With any mention of the US, you're making up a scenario and then using it as an excuse to not do something we have a duty to do - extradite him to Sweden! IMO we extradite him to Sweden and then see whether things play out as you predict. If they do, unlucky him (although some may say he brought it on himself) and we may change our opinions of Sweden and the US, two of our greatest allies and trading partners. But in the meantime, second-guessing seems disingenuous.
With any mention of the US, you're making up a scenario and then using it as an excuse to not do something we have a duty to do - extradite him to Sweden! IMO we extradite him to Sweden and then see whether things play out as you predict. If they do, unlucky him (although some may say he brought it on himself) and we may change our opinions of Sweden and the US, two of our greatest allies and trading partners. But in the meantime, second-guessing seems disingenuous.
"We're being asked to extradite him to Sweden, and our own legal process has already agreed to do this - it was then that he jumped bail!"
because he was obviously waiting to see the outcome, if the extradition was refused then he wouldnt have needed to jump bail, he would just have to watch his back from those sneaky scurrilous americans.
If you really think the USA doesnt want him desperately then youre kidding yourself.
Just like Israel and iran if the USA can get someone else to do the dirty groundwork for it then its more than happy, in this case theyre happy to use Sweden and then theyll take it from there.
because he was obviously waiting to see the outcome, if the extradition was refused then he wouldnt have needed to jump bail, he would just have to watch his back from those sneaky scurrilous americans.
If you really think the USA doesnt want him desperately then youre kidding yourself.
Just like Israel and iran if the USA can get someone else to do the dirty groundwork for it then its more than happy, in this case theyre happy to use Sweden and then theyll take it from there.
Baz, whether the Americans want him or not is not our problem. They haven't asked us for him and we're not giving him to them.
Sweden have asked us for him. Sweden is not a country that engages in waterboarding or the death penalty. Almost exactly two years ago, on 18 August 2010, Assange actually applied for for a residence permit to live and work in Sweden, hoping to create a base for Wikileaks there, because of the country's laws protecting whistle-blowers. He didn't take a dislike to Sweden until they accused him of rape!
Have a read of the history of the potted history of the extradition case here:
http://
I suggest you start at the bottom and work your way up, as it makes more sense in chronological order. Then tell me why we shouldn't extradite him to Sweden, and why we should continue to spend taxpayers' time and money on him in this country.
Sweden have asked us for him. Sweden is not a country that engages in waterboarding or the death penalty. Almost exactly two years ago, on 18 August 2010, Assange actually applied for for a residence permit to live and work in Sweden, hoping to create a base for Wikileaks there, because of the country's laws protecting whistle-blowers. He didn't take a dislike to Sweden until they accused him of rape!
Have a read of the history of the potted history of the extradition case here:
http://
I suggest you start at the bottom and work your way up, as it makes more sense in chronological order. Then tell me why we shouldn't extradite him to Sweden, and why we should continue to spend taxpayers' time and money on him in this country.
"the Economist's Democracy Index ..."
Ellipsis , grow up .
The Swedes are still trying to find who assassinated their Prime Minister Olof Palme . They framed a local drug addict as a sop to public opinion then released him a couple of years later .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olof_Palme
Ellipsis , grow up .
The Swedes are still trying to find who assassinated their Prime Minister Olof Palme . They framed a local drug addict as a sop to public opinion then released him a couple of years later .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olof_Palme
This whole thing stinks. Even if technically we can go in, we'd be foolish to. How many embassies around the world would be stormed by governements following this precident and I don;t just mean British ones.
Assange has managed to upset the western powers. They are making him pay. We are assiting the Americans, the whole thing is Shameful.
Assange has managed to upset the western powers. They are making him pay. We are assiting the Americans, the whole thing is Shameful.
Grow up? I'm not the one making up a story about what's going to happen in the future, based on no facts whatsoever, then using that story to suggest why the UK shouldn't extradite someone to Sweden on rape charges.
The biggest flaw in the story is that Sweden is more likely to extradite him to the US than we are! Bear in mind he wanted to base himself in Sweden in the first place, presuambly thinking he'd be reasonably safe from extradition to the US there. I wonder why he chose Sweden rather than Ecuador back in 2010 ...
The biggest flaw in the story is that Sweden is more likely to extradite him to the US than we are! Bear in mind he wanted to base himself in Sweden in the first place, presuambly thinking he'd be reasonably safe from extradition to the US there. I wonder why he chose Sweden rather than Ecuador back in 2010 ...
correct me if i'm wrong I believe the last time we went into an embassy was the storming of the Iranian one.
But we werent so quick to go into the libyan embasy though when they murdered a policewomen.
"why the UK shouldn't extradite someone to Sweden on rape charges"
he hasnt been charged with anything
"The biggest flaw in the story is that Sweden is more likely to extradite him to the US than we are!"
but the US of A hasnt asked us to extradite him have they, they dont need to because theyre pretty damn confident that we will hand him over to the swedes and from then its job done, and you can bet your bottom dollar (pun intended) they would have made enquiries to the powers that be as to how likey the extadition order to Sweden would be granted.
you dont think they would just sit there and leave things to chance do you.
If they were told it would be highly unlikely to be granted you can be sure they would have had a plan B and a plan C if needed etc.
But we werent so quick to go into the libyan embasy though when they murdered a policewomen.
"why the UK shouldn't extradite someone to Sweden on rape charges"
he hasnt been charged with anything
"The biggest flaw in the story is that Sweden is more likely to extradite him to the US than we are!"
but the US of A hasnt asked us to extradite him have they, they dont need to because theyre pretty damn confident that we will hand him over to the swedes and from then its job done, and you can bet your bottom dollar (pun intended) they would have made enquiries to the powers that be as to how likey the extadition order to Sweden would be granted.
you dont think they would just sit there and leave things to chance do you.
If they were told it would be highly unlikely to be granted you can be sure they would have had a plan B and a plan C if needed etc.
I'll repeat - potted history of the extradition case here:
http://
Now please explain why we shouldn't extradite him to Sweden, and why we should continue to spend taxpayers' money on him in this country.
Is it because you think that Sweden is more likely to extradite him to the US than the UK is? On what do you base this judgement?
http://
Now please explain why we shouldn't extradite him to Sweden, and why we should continue to spend taxpayers' money on him in this country.
Is it because you think that Sweden is more likely to extradite him to the US than the UK is? On what do you base this judgement?
We are trying to fulfil our obligation to have him extradited to Sweden to face charges of rape. The US has nothing to do with it. He's far less likely to be extradited to the US from Sweden than he is from the UK.
The rest is just posturing by the Ecuadoreans. Do you honestly think they could care less about him?
The rest is just posturing by the Ecuadoreans. Do you honestly think they could care less about him?
A fairly clear assessment, I think, of the situation in the link listed....
http://
http://
Haque said today that Assange could be hold up in the embassy for months. So why don't they resolve it more quickly:
1. Get Sweden to promise not to send Assange to the US.
2. or get the US to say extradition will not be sought either from the UK or Sweden.
To storm the embassy is completely bonkers as it sends a precedent for any foreign power to do the same. I wonder why so many policemen are currently stationed outside the embassy. Is it to put the frighteners on the embassy staff? To stop Assange escaping?
It seems this government are more concerned about people leaving the country than those trying illegally to get in.!
1. Get Sweden to promise not to send Assange to the US.
2. or get the US to say extradition will not be sought either from the UK or Sweden.
To storm the embassy is completely bonkers as it sends a precedent for any foreign power to do the same. I wonder why so many policemen are currently stationed outside the embassy. Is it to put the frighteners on the embassy staff? To stop Assange escaping?
It seems this government are more concerned about people leaving the country than those trying illegally to get in.!
It really stinks!
We have Abu Hamza, charged with terrorism and we're unable to extradite him.
We have Assange, not charged with anything, just wanted for questioning, and we have dozens of police hovering on the pavement.
Does Assange not have human rights, faced with extradition to the US, who have an abominable record?
Shame on the BBC, who are shouting about rape and sexual assault without reporting the likelihood of easy extradition from Sweden?
We have Abu Hamza, charged with terrorism and we're unable to extradite him.
We have Assange, not charged with anything, just wanted for questioning, and we have dozens of police hovering on the pavement.
Does Assange not have human rights, faced with extradition to the US, who have an abominable record?
Shame on the BBC, who are shouting about rape and sexual assault without reporting the likelihood of easy extradition from Sweden?
> Does Assange not have human rights
He does, which is why the UK spent two years processing his case, through various appeals all the way up to the Supreme Court. When he lost that appeal he skipped bail and ran to that great bastion of human rights, Ecuador.
> faced with extradition to the US
He isn't! Do we refuse to extradite him to Sweden based on the assumption that the US may ask Sweden to extradite him? Do we not trust Sweden to be able to cope with such a request, even if it was to be made? Do we think the UK would make a better job of handling this as-yet-non-existent request?
> Shame on the BBC, who are shouting about rape and sexual assault
That's why he's being extradited, and that's what they're reporting on.
> without reporting the likelihood of easy extradition from Sweden
Is extradition from Sweden easier than from the UK? What evidence do you have of this? Normally the country that's accused of being a "puppet" of the US is the UK, not Sweden. Two years ago Assange tried to get residence in Sweden precisely because he thought it was a good base for Wikileaks.
The link posted by LazyGun sums up the situation well:
http://
He does, which is why the UK spent two years processing his case, through various appeals all the way up to the Supreme Court. When he lost that appeal he skipped bail and ran to that great bastion of human rights, Ecuador.
> faced with extradition to the US
He isn't! Do we refuse to extradite him to Sweden based on the assumption that the US may ask Sweden to extradite him? Do we not trust Sweden to be able to cope with such a request, even if it was to be made? Do we think the UK would make a better job of handling this as-yet-non-existent request?
> Shame on the BBC, who are shouting about rape and sexual assault
That's why he's being extradited, and that's what they're reporting on.
> without reporting the likelihood of easy extradition from Sweden
Is extradition from Sweden easier than from the UK? What evidence do you have of this? Normally the country that's accused of being a "puppet" of the US is the UK, not Sweden. Two years ago Assange tried to get residence in Sweden precisely because he thought it was a good base for Wikileaks.
The link posted by LazyGun sums up the situation well:
http://
Well said Ellipsis. The muddled thinking on this issue is staggering.
Not being one for conspiracy theories I do wonder nonetheless if a certain government in Moscow might have prompted Ecuador to force this issue round about now to divert attention from their persecution of Pussy Riot, with the 'verdict' and sentence due tomorrow. Probably not but who knows ...
Not being one for conspiracy theories I do wonder nonetheless if a certain government in Moscow might have prompted Ecuador to force this issue round about now to divert attention from their persecution of Pussy Riot, with the 'verdict' and sentence due tomorrow. Probably not but who knows ...
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