Religious Sensibilities Vs Animal Rights

[mushroom25]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17966327

which should take priority?

[Baldric]

Religion causing yet more trouble!

[Zeuhl]

/No. But less painful. /

Who says?

[pixie373]

I've seen humane bolts used on horses and it is totally instant. I admit i haven't had my throat cut, but i imagine it would hurt.

[RATTER15]

"Do you think being dragged into a noisy industrial slaughterhouse and having a captive bolt rammed up against your forehead is any more 'instantaneous'?"

So you think that animals slaughtered for Halal are wrapped in cotton wool before having their throats cut?

no they are also dragged through the a noisy industrial slaughterhouse.

[naomi24]

The question isn't about human rights - it's about religious sensibilities - something that should never be allowed to take precedence over anything that causes harm, distress, suffering - or inconvenience - to any living creature.

[Zeuhl]

You may be right pixie but this anti halal/kosher rhetoric makes me uneasy for three reasons.

1. I visited an abattoir years ago and it was a nightmare with terrified animals (clearly aware of what was going to happen) being dragged and kicked into the place where they were 'stunned' by people who clearly were not the most sensitive or caring souls.

2. while in Indonesia and Africa I have seen animals killed in the traditional manner twice and on both occasions I was impressed by the apparent lack of distress

3. an acquaintance who breeds goats for meat but is concerned about welfare of her animals told me she much prefers sending them to the halal abattoir as the place is quiet, peaceful and the goats are handled sensitively and remain calm right up to the point when a skilled operator cuts the carotid with a razor sharp knife and renders them senseless

[Zeuhl]

/So you think that animals slaughtered for Halal are wrapped in cotton wool before having their throats cut?

no they are also dragged through the a noisy industrial slaughterhouse. /

Are you sure about that Ratter? That's not what my goat breeder acquaintance told me.

Maybe she uses a posh abattoir?

[Brinjal]

One of the most distressing thing I have seen regarding meat for consumption was when Gordon Ramsey took the two pigs he had raised (Trinny and Susanah) to be slaughtered. The two were together one was grabbed and that stunning apparatus was put on its head. The other one came very agitated and I'm my opinion new that something unpleasant was happening. Nothing religious about it just horrible

[RATTER15]

At the end of the day there is nothing humane about killing anything.

[naomi24]

I think the question relates to the principle of acceding to religious sensibilities simply because they are religious rather than the most humane way to slaughter an animal.

[Zeuhl]

naomi

the consensus seems to be that religious mumbo jumbo aside, there isn't much reason to prefer one supposedly more humane form of slaughter over another

[naomi24]

I think that whole discussion derails the thread because it doesn't address the original question.

[Zeuhl]

But the question in the context of the linked article pre-supposes that non stunning slaughter violates animals' rights more than the conventional methods

However, generally speaking I don't agree with any religious sensibilities taking priority over animals' rights to be well treated.

[Baldric]

Animal rights should come first, the religions cited have been imported into the UK over the years and we have been soft enough to change the rules to accommodate them,
Whatever happened to "When in Rome . . . . .?"

[Zeuhl]

/the religions cited have been imported into the UK over the years/

How long do you think it is Baldric since the first Jews were 'imported'?

I suspect it pre-dates our laws on abattoir practices by a long way

[naomi24]

I think the problem arose when people discovered that they were unwittingly buying and being fed meat slaughtered according to the requirements of Judaism and Islam - but that's not the issue either.

[jomifl]

In humans the brain remains concious for between about 5 and 30 seconds after heart failure so I wouldn't be unreasonable to expect a halal slaughtered animal to remain concious for a similar time.

[mikey4444]

To be honest, as an atheist I am getting a tad p*ssed off with religious people telling me that they have to do something awful, just because their faith tells them to. If its cruel to kill an animal by ritual means, than that should apply to everyone, not just us atheists !

[steg]

and a vegetarian would probably say that killing an animal for food is cruel, that should apply to every one not just us vegetarians