Shouldn't The Gay Couple Have Been Arrested For Harassment?

[anotheoldgit]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2593217/Christian-preacher-wins-13-000-wrongful-arrest-telling-gay-couple-Bible-says-homosexuality-sin.html

/// At 7pm the unnamed gay couple approached him and asked what he thought of gay people. ///

/// He said it did not matter what he thought, only what God believes, telling them: 'whilst God hates sin He loves the sinner'. ///

/// Mr Craven then claimed the teenagers began kissing in front of him and taunting him with crude and suggestive sexual acts. Shortly afterwards the preacher was arrested. ///

[anotheoldgit]

sp1814

/// I find the sequence of events odd. ///

/// He was preaching. ///

/// Two blokes snogged in front of him. ///

/// Then they went and reported him to the police. ///

/// There are bits missing. ///

Yes there are.

*** Mr Craven then claimed the teenagers began kissing in front of him and taunting him with crude and suggestive sexual acts. ***

/// Now...what did he say? "You two perverts will get your just desserts in hell?" "You are an abomination...and the Daily Mail was right when they said that finding the gay gene gave 'abortion hope to mothers'". ///

All rather a bigoted assumption.

/// If he was trotting out the usual fundamentalist claptrap, I would not shed tears over his arrest personally. ///

*** Mr Craven won his damages under the Human Rights Act quoting his entitlement to enjoy the freedom to manifest his religion (Article 9) and freedom of expression, including the freedom to impart information and ideas without interference by a public authority (Article 10). ***

Since he won his compensation because of this ruling, it proves that even the law doesn't agree with you.

[sp1814]

naomi24

Horrible as it is, I've heard similar from the Christian protesters who decided to turn up a Gay Pride in Brighton four years ago.

Totally unreported.

The crowds just wolf-whistled at them.

Eventually they went.

[sp1814]

AOG

It's irrelevant.

You asked whether the gay couple should have been arrested for harassment.

No.

Do you.

[sp1814]

naomi24

The reason I bring up that thing about the Daily Mail abortion story...is because it's true. They ran that headline back in the 90s.

I just don't trust stories that the DM run which deal with gay people' because It has a pretty nasty history (from the Jan Moir / Stephen Gately article, right up to Amanda Platell's rant last week).

[naomi24]

SP, you may have heard that, but that’s no reason to imply that this man behaved similarly. Sounds to me like this gay couple had no respect for anyone - including themselves.

[sp1814]

naomi24

But why not?

Why are we assuming that the story as we read it, is 100% accurate? I am *not* saying that this is what he definitely said. No, I'm giving an alternative slant on events, because we do not know what he said. All we have is his word.

[anotheoldgit]

sp1814

/// You asked whether the gay couple should have been arrested for harassment. ///

/// Do you. ///

If the said Mr Craven is to be believed, (and there is nothing to suggest that he was lying). when he said that they were taunting him with crude and suggestive sexual acts, then yes they should haver been arrested.

[naomi24]

SP, //All we have is his word. //

.... and he has his compensation for wrongful arrest ... which must tell you something.

[sp1814]

naomi24

You know what I find annoying?

The volume of press this gets, against the number of young gay people who are attacked and beaten in homophobic attacks, and it barely gets a mention in the national press.

Imagine if the same level of attacks were being perpetrated against any other minority - there would be a national outcry.

And these attacks are tacitly promoted by religious groups who have for decades...centuries...told us that gay people are singers....that gay people are 'less than'...that gay people are to be excluded.

This is why I find it difficult to summon up much sympathy - even for those who say, "Hate the sin, not the sinner", because frankly - their flock don't practice that distinction.

I have a friend from a Roman Catholic family, whose parents found out he was gay. Threw him out of the house and not only banned him from seeing his younger brothers until they'd left home, but wouldn't let him attend his own grandmother's funeral.

That is, unfortunately, way too common a story.

[sp1814]

Arrrghhh

That should have been 'sinners', not 'singers'.

...although...

[anotheoldgit]

sp1814

/// Amanda Platell's rant last week ///

Oh so when anyone voices opinions that you disagree with, it then becomes a rant, that says much about yourself.

I present the said opinion.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2592091/AMANDA-PLATELL-The-real-gay-marriage-bigots-intolerant-supporters.html

[sp1814]

AOG

Well, we don't know.

Also, the payout was for wrongful arrest. That surely doesn't prove that he was provoked?

However, I take naomi24's point...if he *had* been using stronger language, it would have been difficult for him to get compensation to that degree.

[Baldric]

I wonder, just out of curiosity, was the Police Officer gay and maybe abusing his position, or is this an uncomfortable position for some?

[sp1814]

AOG

As so eloquently put here:

http://themediablog.typepad.com

[sp1814]

AOG

And here's the Stephen Gately rant by Jan Moir.

It was published to coincide with his funeral.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1220756/A-strange-lonely-troubling-death--.html

The original title was A Strange and Unnatural Death of Stephen Gately.

I think we all know what Jan was getting at with 'Unnatural'.

Let's not wander down this path. I'm sure we both have very different ideas on how the Daily Mail reports on gay issues. Let's just agree to disagree, because I feel I'm steering your thread off track (as per usual).

[naomi24]

SP, I know you find it annoying and I understand that, but you make the same mistake a lot of people with an axe to grind make – you defend your cause regardless of the situation. People who support political parties do it, black people do it, white anti-immigration supporters do it, the religious do it, people who want to curry favour do it – they all do it – and it’s disingenuous. I detest religion, but right is right, and although he is religious, if this man has been poorly treated then I won’t pretend otherwise – or make excuses for the people who have treated him poorly.

[Svejk]

///The volume of press this gets, against the number of young gay people who are attacked and beaten in homophobic attacks, and it barely gets a mention in the national press.///

thats cos its a well known fact that young gay people always start the fights.

[anotheoldgit]

sp1814

/// And these attacks are tacitly promoted by religious groups ///

Once again an exaggerated statement.

I doubt very much if the type of person who goes out purposely to attack and beat up young gay people in such homophobic attacks, really have one religious bone in their bodies.

[sp1814]

AOG

You don't necessarily have to be religious yourself to be influenced, or some might say, indoctrinated into believing gay people are inherently wicked, or evil or 'less than'.

The Russian Orthodox Church, a large number of Christian African nations, the Deep South of America, the Middle East and the West Indies.

They all have one thing in common. High degrees of religious observance and an ingrained hatred of gay people.