How it Works12 mins ago
When Is An Assault Not An Assault? When It Is A Gay Assault Apparently.
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/// It called to mind, however, innumerable young men I have met on the gay scene over the last 20 years, men who have been abused but who do not consider themselves victims, do not attach words such as "rape" or "sexual assault" to their experiences, do not feel able to wield consent, and do not think they can complain, or report it. ///
/// It called to mind, however, innumerable young men I have met on the gay scene over the last 20 years, men who have been abused but who do not consider themselves victims, do not attach words such as "rape" or "sexual assault" to their experiences, do not feel able to wield consent, and do not think they can complain, or report it. ///
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AOG
Interesting article, but I don't think the author came to the same conclusion as you.
This section is especially prescient:
"Section 28, forbidding the "promotion" of homosexuality, which gagged teachers from discussing it at all, was in effect from 1988 to 2003, but its shadow loomed for years after. To grow up gay in the Eighties, Nineties and part of the Noughties was to be the great unuttered, one's existence unacknowledged by those in loco parentis, muzzled by fear and law, unable to help or validate.
Add to this an epidemic of homophobic bullying that still pervades, and where as recently as 2012 (according to a study by Stonewall) 99 per cent of school children hear "gay" used as a pejorative. The majority of gay pupils report being bullied – 60 per cent of whom say that teachers who witness this do not intervene.
But the erosion of self-worth is both subtler and more panoramic than these obvious markers. It is compounded by a pressure to conform to gender roles while being pushed into a protective self-made closet – preventing truthful, intimate bonds among peers – amid a heteronormative society that validates little about a gay person's identity. As a minor, the message from every angle is clear: you are not welcome and you are not safe."
Interesting article, but I don't think the author came to the same conclusion as you.
This section is especially prescient:
"Section 28, forbidding the "promotion" of homosexuality, which gagged teachers from discussing it at all, was in effect from 1988 to 2003, but its shadow loomed for years after. To grow up gay in the Eighties, Nineties and part of the Noughties was to be the great unuttered, one's existence unacknowledged by those in loco parentis, muzzled by fear and law, unable to help or validate.
Add to this an epidemic of homophobic bullying that still pervades, and where as recently as 2012 (according to a study by Stonewall) 99 per cent of school children hear "gay" used as a pejorative. The majority of gay pupils report being bullied – 60 per cent of whom say that teachers who witness this do not intervene.
But the erosion of self-worth is both subtler and more panoramic than these obvious markers. It is compounded by a pressure to conform to gender roles while being pushed into a protective self-made closet – preventing truthful, intimate bonds among peers – amid a heteronormative society that validates little about a gay person's identity. As a minor, the message from every angle is clear: you are not welcome and you are not safe."
I can't see how any non consentual action can be considered as anything but assault, homo or hetero sexual. Of course a prosecution can only continue if the person sees themselves as a sufficient enough victim to press a charge. This problem is again present in both.
I wonder if the same feeling/attitude exists amongst the lesbian community or whether it is a 'male' thing. Does anyone know?
I wonder if the same feeling/attitude exists amongst the lesbian community or whether it is a 'male' thing. Does anyone know?
AOG
You asked:
"What are you suggesting that both yours and the author of the piece, think that being assaulted and raped is all part and parcel of being gay?"
No. Not at all.
I think that this this is a well-written article which has highlighted issues that the wider public may not know about.
I commend you on drawing further attention to it.
You asked:
"What are you suggesting that both yours and the author of the piece, think that being assaulted and raped is all part and parcel of being gay?"
No. Not at all.
I think that this this is a well-written article which has highlighted issues that the wider public may not know about.
I commend you on drawing further attention to it.
TGT - The fear was that the 'discussion' of homosexuality (if it was held it anything other than a negative light) could be construed as 'promotion', because the definition of 'promotion' was so vague....and in order not to fall foul of that pernicious piece of legislation many LEAs simply side-stepped any sort of discussion on the matter.
sp is quite correct on the point.
sp is quite correct on the point.
That's not how it worked out, ymb.
LEAs were worried that parents would complain that their children were being influenced/corrupted by homosexuality being given any sort of positive light. In order to prevent that happening, and precisely because the word 'promotion' was open to interpretation and they feared losing any costly court-cases the whole topic was brushed under the carpet for a whole generation of school-children.
LEAs were worried that parents would complain that their children were being influenced/corrupted by homosexuality being given any sort of positive light. In order to prevent that happening, and precisely because the word 'promotion' was open to interpretation and they feared losing any costly court-cases the whole topic was brushed under the carpet for a whole generation of school-children.
what a load of old pony, I'm pretty sure it's illegal to promote drug taking in schools but I've seen assignments from my kids on that subject. Ditto, drug dealing, prostitution, racketeering, slavery! need I go on?! YMB hits the nail on the head again, the right on liberal brigade used the "fear of promotion" argument to supress discussion and call it prohibition and blamed the "nasty" old tories! It was never illegal to discuss sexuality of any nature in schools.
I'll type this slowly so that you can understand it, TGT......
It was the threat of legal action by parents/pressure groups who viewed any discussion as 'promotion' which dissuaded schools from addressing the subject. Few parents are likely to view discussions on the other topics you mention as being any sort of 'promotion' of them.
It was the threat of legal action by parents/pressure groups who viewed any discussion as 'promotion' which dissuaded schools from addressing the subject. Few parents are likely to view discussions on the other topics you mention as being any sort of 'promotion' of them.
How sad that you seem so desperate to drag politics into this. And it's not even correct history anyway on your and ymb's part. The first progress towards allowing homosexuality to be discussed in schools was made by Labour Councils in the 70's and particularly the early 80s. As a reaction to this, "Conservative backbench MPs became concerned that left-wing councils or schools would provide children with pro-homosexuality material or commend homosexuality to children, both described by parliamentarians backing the bill as morally wrong but which could be carefully policed by judges in applying a narrow sense to the meaning of the word promote."
Most of the wrestling over the Amendment and its meaning took place within the Conservative party. All of the major left-wing parties opposed the Bill. I cannot understand how you can portray this as a left-wing conspiracy to stifle discussion. It was anything but.
Regardless of the politics, though, the prime victim was all those children who got taught nothing at all about homosexuality, and therefore went through school thinking it was something to keep secret, and to be ashamed of.
Most of the wrestling over the Amendment and its meaning took place within the Conservative party. All of the major left-wing parties opposed the Bill. I cannot understand how you can portray this as a left-wing conspiracy to stifle discussion. It was anything but.
Regardless of the politics, though, the prime victim was all those children who got taught nothing at all about homosexuality, and therefore went through school thinking it was something to keep secret, and to be ashamed of.
It not got anything to do with the education they either get or do not get in schools.
These are adult men we are talking about, surely even the most naive would not accept this sort of thing as being all part of the gay scene.
/// Other anecdotes were darker: "When I was 18, my then boyfriend's best friend groped me and then assaulted me when I was asleep and I didn't report it because I felt like it was just a rite of passage," says Edward. "My own boyfriend told me he'd been spiked the first time he went out and that things just happened on the [gay] scene." ///
These are adult men we are talking about, surely even the most naive would not accept this sort of thing as being all part of the gay scene.
/// Other anecdotes were darker: "When I was 18, my then boyfriend's best friend groped me and then assaulted me when I was asleep and I didn't report it because I felt like it was just a rite of passage," says Edward. "My own boyfriend told me he'd been spiked the first time he went out and that things just happened on the [gay] scene." ///
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