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Agree Or Disagree?
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AOG - "Are yes the usual Left-Wing response to anything that is not printed in the Guardian or the Morning Star."
I am not a 'left-winger', I don't read the Guardian or the Morning Star and my daily (delivered) paper of choice is the Daily Mail.
Not quite sure where this leaves your last observation - ?
I am not a 'left-winger', I don't read the Guardian or the Morning Star and my daily (delivered) paper of choice is the Daily Mail.
Not quite sure where this leaves your last observation - ?
andy-hughes
I am very sorry for what your family went through especially the health issues inflicted on your wife, but one as you have stated before you cannot condemn a religion for the actions of a minority. I refer of course to militant Muslims versus the peace loving ones.
But even if you do blame the whole of Catholicism for your unpleasant experiences, why is your wife still a devout Catholic and why do you go along to their masses, myself I would have cut all ties with them long ago.
I am very sorry for what your family went through especially the health issues inflicted on your wife, but one as you have stated before you cannot condemn a religion for the actions of a minority. I refer of course to militant Muslims versus the peace loving ones.
But even if you do blame the whole of Catholicism for your unpleasant experiences, why is your wife still a devout Catholic and why do you go along to their masses, myself I would have cut all ties with them long ago.
That's very sad Andy and my heart goes out to your wife. And yet another example of the church turning a blind eye. Even the heads of the Catholic church refuses to admonish their members following some truly despicable acts. My very good friend was one of 16 choirboys and lucky to be the only one not to be abused. And my late father-in-law was driven from the Christian church by some particularly nasty individuals. But I do believe this happens in all religions and this is where religions appear to fail, whether it be abuse, terrorism or any other vile act (and if you want to see evidence of heinous crimes in the name of religion - take a look at Scientology). Like you I have no axe to grind and have many friends from different religious backgrounds. But I do agree "stop-evil-Islamic-State" as in the ISIS movement as I agree with putting to an end any form of evil within any religious denomination.
andy-hughes
The Daily Mail? You do surprise me, I am often criticised for posting Daily Mail reports but at least I do not pay for the paper I read their web-site along with others of course.
And not a "Left-Winger" eh, but surely I can be excused from thinking you were, especially after reading what you put:
/// "a right-wing tittle-tattle scaremongering rag like the Daily Express" ///
The Daily Mail? You do surprise me, I am often criticised for posting Daily Mail reports but at least I do not pay for the paper I read their web-site along with others of course.
And not a "Left-Winger" eh, but surely I can be excused from thinking you were, especially after reading what you put:
/// "a right-wing tittle-tattle scaremongering rag like the Daily Express" ///
AOG - "andy-hughes
I am very sorry for what your family went through especially the health issues inflicted on your wife, but one as you have stated before you cannot condemn a religion for the actions of a minority. I refer of course to militant Muslims versus the peace loving ones."
Thank you for your kind words.
My position with regard to the Catholic church is that dreadful evil acts are carried out in the name of almost all major religions - i would not single out Christianity, or a specific branch of it, although I appreciate that my posts may appear that I do bear a specific grudge.
"But even if you do blame the whole of Catholicism for your unpleasant experiences, why is your wife still a devout Catholic and why do you go along to their masses, myself I would have cut all ties with them long ago."
As advised, I don't blame all of Catholicism.
As to why my wife remains a Catholic, I put it down to the majority support she received from her friends within the church - clergy and congregation - which I think is the essential goodness of the human race personified.
I attend Mass because I like the singing, and I enjoy the atmosphere of the Mass, and the cup of tea afterwards. I am able to do this without having the merest scintila of belief in what is being offered - but I don't find that a problem. It is simply the ability to think differently that makes us human.
I am very sorry for what your family went through especially the health issues inflicted on your wife, but one as you have stated before you cannot condemn a religion for the actions of a minority. I refer of course to militant Muslims versus the peace loving ones."
Thank you for your kind words.
My position with regard to the Catholic church is that dreadful evil acts are carried out in the name of almost all major religions - i would not single out Christianity, or a specific branch of it, although I appreciate that my posts may appear that I do bear a specific grudge.
"But even if you do blame the whole of Catholicism for your unpleasant experiences, why is your wife still a devout Catholic and why do you go along to their masses, myself I would have cut all ties with them long ago."
As advised, I don't blame all of Catholicism.
As to why my wife remains a Catholic, I put it down to the majority support she received from her friends within the church - clergy and congregation - which I think is the essential goodness of the human race personified.
I attend Mass because I like the singing, and I enjoy the atmosphere of the Mass, and the cup of tea afterwards. I am able to do this without having the merest scintila of belief in what is being offered - but I don't find that a problem. It is simply the ability to think differently that makes us human.
AOG - "andy-hughes
The Daily Mail? You do surprise me, I am often criticised for posting Daily Mail reports but at least I do not pay for the paper I read their web-site along with others of course."
We have discussed this previously - perhaps you have forgotten?
I must say that i find the on-line version of the paper to be far more scurillous than the printed version.
"And not a "Left-Winger" eh, but surely I can be excused from thinking you were, especially after reading what you put:
/// "a right-wing tittle-tattle scaremongering rag like the Daily Express" ///"
You can be exused - but disliking the right-wing stance of one daily paper does not automatically lead to me embracing the politics of the left wing.
The Daily Mail? You do surprise me, I am often criticised for posting Daily Mail reports but at least I do not pay for the paper I read their web-site along with others of course."
We have discussed this previously - perhaps you have forgotten?
I must say that i find the on-line version of the paper to be far more scurillous than the printed version.
"And not a "Left-Winger" eh, but surely I can be excused from thinking you were, especially after reading what you put:
/// "a right-wing tittle-tattle scaremongering rag like the Daily Express" ///"
You can be exused - but disliking the right-wing stance of one daily paper does not automatically lead to me embracing the politics of the left wing.
Baboonboy - thank you for your kind words.
Are you new? I don't recognise your name - if so, you are very welcome.
I agree that any organised religion can lead to power struggles and cliques, some people banding together to put considerable time and effort into getting their way at the expense of innocent people.
i wonder though if it is because almost any voluntary organisation - including in my experience The Samaritans - attracts those who are unfulfilled and who feel powerless, and use their perceived position within their organisation to exercise a pseudo-power in order to reaffirm themselves.
It happened during my wife's ordeal, when clergy and some parents banded together to present a horrible hostile front, even though they were in complete ignorance of the facts of the issue.
i saw it happen during my time as a Samaritan volunteer when the local Branch Leader was hounded out of her role, and the branch, by a cabal of volunteers who enjoyed secret meetings and correspondence to undermine her.
Ironic considering the ethos of that organisation - but i do believe that the trend exists wherever non-payment is involved - attracting people with little to occupy their time, so their Machiavellian machinations expand to make them feel 'valuable'.
It is just my opinion, but I think evidence bears it out.
Are you new? I don't recognise your name - if so, you are very welcome.
I agree that any organised religion can lead to power struggles and cliques, some people banding together to put considerable time and effort into getting their way at the expense of innocent people.
i wonder though if it is because almost any voluntary organisation - including in my experience The Samaritans - attracts those who are unfulfilled and who feel powerless, and use their perceived position within their organisation to exercise a pseudo-power in order to reaffirm themselves.
It happened during my wife's ordeal, when clergy and some parents banded together to present a horrible hostile front, even though they were in complete ignorance of the facts of the issue.
i saw it happen during my time as a Samaritan volunteer when the local Branch Leader was hounded out of her role, and the branch, by a cabal of volunteers who enjoyed secret meetings and correspondence to undermine her.
Ironic considering the ethos of that organisation - but i do believe that the trend exists wherever non-payment is involved - attracting people with little to occupy their time, so their Machiavellian machinations expand to make them feel 'valuable'.
It is just my opinion, but I think evidence bears it out.
andy-hughes
/// As advised, I don't blame all of Catholicism. ///
/// I have no problem per se with Muslims, or with Christians - just major issues with the Catholic faith based on personal experience. ///
Perhaps to stop any confusion on my part may I suggest that instead of the above you could have put:
"I have no problem per se with Muslims, or with Christians - just major issues with 'SOME MEMBERS' of the Catholic faith based on personal experience".
/// As advised, I don't blame all of Catholicism. ///
/// I have no problem per se with Muslims, or with Christians - just major issues with the Catholic faith based on personal experience. ///
Perhaps to stop any confusion on my part may I suggest that instead of the above you could have put:
"I have no problem per se with Muslims, or with Christians - just major issues with 'SOME MEMBERS' of the Catholic faith based on personal experience".
andy-hughes
/// You can be exused - but disliking the right-wing stance of one daily paper does not automatically lead to me embracing the politics of the left wing. ///
Once again it is your words that cause the confusion, anyone who puts
/// The day I take the remotest notice of anything a right-wing tittle-tattle scaremongering rag like the Daily Express has to say will never come. ///
Could only be rightfully accused of being on the opposite side to the 'right' of politics.
Had you had put:
"The day I take the remotest notice of anything a tittle-tattle, scaremongering rag like the Daily Express has to say will never come".
Then no confusion would have occurred.
/// You can be exused - but disliking the right-wing stance of one daily paper does not automatically lead to me embracing the politics of the left wing. ///
Once again it is your words that cause the confusion, anyone who puts
/// The day I take the remotest notice of anything a right-wing tittle-tattle scaremongering rag like the Daily Express has to say will never come. ///
Could only be rightfully accused of being on the opposite side to the 'right' of politics.
Had you had put:
"The day I take the remotest notice of anything a tittle-tattle, scaremongering rag like the Daily Express has to say will never come".
Then no confusion would have occurred.
Is it social pressure that brings many worshippers to the Mosque? I'm thinking back to when I was younger the chapels used to be packed. And standing at the back of the congregation would be teenagers and young men in their 20s. They had no interest in being there but seemed to feel it had to be endured.
sandyRoe - "Is it social pressure that brings many worshippers to the Mosque?"
I am sure it is.
The Muslim faith is woven into the lives of its people to a far greater degree than that of the Christian faith.
Attendence at Friday Prayers is expected, and absences would be noticed and questioned - which rarely occurs in Christian churches, certainly not in these times.
I am sure it is.
The Muslim faith is woven into the lives of its people to a far greater degree than that of the Christian faith.
Attendence at Friday Prayers is expected, and absences would be noticed and questioned - which rarely occurs in Christian churches, certainly not in these times.
AOG - "Well we won't mention your continuous spelling mistakes Andy ..."
My professional writing is thoroughly checked for spelling and grammer before dispatch - obviously I bother less in casual conversation as on here.
" ..or that you have difficulties in expressing yourself in written English, it is simply the way you choose to express yourself."
I don't have difficulty expressing myself - the difficultlty is yours, and speaking of the "We..." bit - who is this 'We'?
I think you'l find it's 'I' you need there - no-one else appears confused, only you.
My professional writing is thoroughly checked for spelling and grammer before dispatch - obviously I bother less in casual conversation as on here.
" ..or that you have difficulties in expressing yourself in written English, it is simply the way you choose to express yourself."
I don't have difficulty expressing myself - the difficultlty is yours, and speaking of the "We..." bit - who is this 'We'?
I think you'l find it's 'I' you need there - no-one else appears confused, only you.
AOG - "andy-hughes
/// Attendence at Friday Prayers is expected, and absences would be noticed and questioned - which rarely occurs in Christian churches, certainly not in these times. ///
Have you ever lived in a small village Andy? When even the Vicar notices if one doesn't attend."
No I haven't, but my wife has taught in an inner-city school where the majority of the pupils are Muslim, and she has seen the weals on the feet of children where they have been beaten by the Iman for missing Prayers, or not being able to recite extracts from the Koran.
A little different from a raised eyebrow from the vicar, I think you'd agree!
/// Attendence at Friday Prayers is expected, and absences would be noticed and questioned - which rarely occurs in Christian churches, certainly not in these times. ///
Have you ever lived in a small village Andy? When even the Vicar notices if one doesn't attend."
No I haven't, but my wife has taught in an inner-city school where the majority of the pupils are Muslim, and she has seen the weals on the feet of children where they have been beaten by the Iman for missing Prayers, or not being able to recite extracts from the Koran.
A little different from a raised eyebrow from the vicar, I think you'd agree!
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