I You Go To Syria To Fight...don't Complain When You're Sentenced.

[sp1814]

I applaud the sentence handed down to these men.

I applaud their families for turning them in.

However, I totally disagree with this statement from the family involved:

"We feel completely betrayed."

They objected to the sentence as "too long" and said they would appeal against it.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-30348153

A analogy...if a turned in a member of my family whom I knew to be a rapist, I would not complain when the sentence was handed down. It's down to the courts to decide what the sentence should be, not me.

How do you feel about this?

And can anyone confirm whether I've used the word 'whom' correctly here? I literally have no idea...

[starone]

Sometimes when appeals are made the court decides to put the sentences up rather than down. Let's hope they do that! Whom is o.k.

[Cloverjo]

I can understand the family for being upset about the length of the sentence, but they shouldn't have expected a more lenient one in exchange for their help in getting the arrests.

I think it should be "who" but there will be people who disagree with me. "Who" and "whom" are both often used in this context, though.

[sandyRoe]

Hotheads who are prepared to go and risk their lives in Syria are hardly likely to be deterred by a prison sentence.
Their families are likely to think twice before reporting them. Could the authorities have shot themselves in the foot?

[vetuste_ennemi]

I believe it's incorrect, SP - or do I? As a simple object it would be correct, e.g: "a son WHOM I loved.". But if the object is qualified by a clause, as in "who I knew was a rapist" then WHO is correct. The "I knew" in this context would be parenthetic. In your post, however, the object is qualified by a phrase "knew to be...". So maybe you're right after all.

[BlackadderV]

You have used the word 'whom' correctly, as it is the object of the clause, not the subject.

[BlackadderV]

You say, 'I know him to be a fool' - not, I know he to be a fool. This is the classic accusative and infinitive used in indirect statements in Latin.

[douglas9401]

'We feel completely betrayed'

As do we when British born dullards commit disgusting crimes in the name of an imaginary ghost in the clouds.
You'll get over it.

[vetuste_ennemi]

Yes, stupid me! It is the simple object of the verb "knew". Back to the booze, deeply chastened. Will spend rest of evening plotting a cruel revenge on Blackadder for embarrasing me.

[BlackadderV]

Don't be too hard on yourself. If instead of 'whom I knew to be a rapist' he had written, 'who, I knew, was a rapist' then you would be correct.

[mushroom25]

their MP, Khaled Mahmood, was interviewed by Midlands Today this evening. he very tactfully answered a question relating to a reporting family being betrayed, by saying that the community should be working toward stopping these young men leaving for Syria in the first place.

[Orderlimit]

I thought the sentence rather lenient, parole eligibility date is 2022.

[TWR]

Hard SH---T, they went on their jollies with the intent of killing someone including children, enjoy your porridge.

[jourdain2]

Tough! No problem saying that. French 'Jihadists' are wanting to return home too.......hot-headed young men; but they have gone far too far. Personally, I would say that if you deliberately leave your country to fight for its enemy then you have committed treason and the punishment for that until very recently was death. I would support the reintroduction of the death penalty for treason - it is a reasoned and deliberate act, unlike the many which (correctly) led to the withdrawal of the death penalty for murder.

[jno]

whom is correct.

There's something to be said for lessening the sentences of people who are turned in by their families - otherwise families have no incentive to do it, and how does that help us?

Has anyone been arrested for going off to fight against Isis?

[sandyRoe]

If a young Zionist went out to Israel to serve a stint in the IDF would he/she risk facing the full majesty of the law when they returned to the UK?

[ludwig]

I can see the parent's point of view. It must be a bit like if you found out you kid had been stealing sweets from the shop, and you reported it to the police, expecting them to get 'a good talking to and the fright of their lives', only to have them arrested and sent to borstal for a couple of years.

You'd be wishing you hadn't tried to do the right thing, and any other parents watching would be thinking, well I won't be making that mistake. I'll keep quiet about it.

Still, it had to happen. You can't just get away with a slap on the wrist for trying to join an international gang of murderous terrorists, no matter how retarded and naive you might be.

[tonyav]

Don't think much of the spelling in the email.
http://www.expressandstar.com/news/2014/12/05/jailed-nearly-13-years-for-west-midlands-pair-who-travelled-to-syria-to-commit-acts-of-terrorism/

[sandyRoe]

It's from a Dane writing in English. I couldn't write one word other than Tubourg or Carlsberg in Danish.