Who'd Be A Teacher....

[ToraToraTora]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-35431782
Have decades of right on liberal policies turned schools into places of misery for teachers and children who want to learn?

[andy-hughes]

Not just 'right on liberal policies', Tora, I recall Sir Keith Joseph from Mrs Thatcher's government adivising that all teachers could expect to be assaulted at least once in their career - he said it as though it was an accepted part of the job description!

Problems in school are not an issue in isolation - they are the symptom of a problem in society, where we are entering a third generation of parents who have no parenting skills.

Concepts of respect and appropriate behaviour are not understood by parents, who should be teaching them to children in advance of school attendance. That, coupled with teachers having discipline procedures steadily eroded by a succession of governments of all colours, means that schools are often dispiriting, violent unhappy places to attend or work in.

[frugalfred]

Well said, andy! Totally agree with that comment.

[Prudie]

I taught for 10 years in a secondary school and never physically abused but certainly verbally. On this occasion I totally agree with AH.

[andy-hughes]

Until any elected government stops treating education as though it is a prize in a vote-winning contest, and actually addresses the root cause of the issues - criminal underfunding and support in nursery and primary education - we will continue to produce children and adults with no understanding of self-respect, tolerance, restraint, and the general qualities needed to live and get along in a civilised society.

[anotheoldgit]

andy-hughes

Modern day parents, please read these quotes, talk about feathering all parents and children with the same brush.

The word that seems to be missing from your vocabulary is the word 'SOME'.

/// where we are entering a third generation of parents who have no parenting skills. ///

/// Concepts of respect and appropriate behaviour are not understood by parents, who should be teaching them to children in advance of school attendance. ///

/// we will continue to produce children and adults with no understanding of self-respect, tolerance, restraint, and the general qualities needed to live and get along in a civilised society. ///

[andy-hughes]

AOG - //Modern day parents, please read these quotes, talk about feathering all parents and children with the same brush. //

A fair point - but I believe that those schools who do manage to create an ethos and environment of happiness and security and support, manage it in spite of government policies and attitudes, not because of them.

[ToraToraTora]

Teachers have no sanctions, kids know it, QED.

[Prudie]

I think all vaguely intelligent people will know that the article, the OP and our responses have taken 'SOME' as a given

[Ellipsis]

> Concepts of respect and appropriate behaviour are not understood by parents, who should be teaching them to children in advance of school attendance.

Surely respect and appropriate behaviour should also be taught and reinforced at school, rather than teachers and decent kids having to accept verbal and physical abuse ...

[andy-hughes]

Ellipsis - //Surely respect and appropriate behaviour should also be taught and reinforced at school, rather than teachers and decent kids having to accept verbal and physical abuse ... //

They are - but when children are arriving in nursery at the age of three, declaiming to the teacher that the teacher 'can't do anything to them ...' then the lines do tend to be drawn.

[Ellipsis]

> declaiming to the teacher that the teacher 'can't do anything to them ...'

But that's not their parents that have made that the case - it's us (i.e. society).

[Sqad]

A-H is spot on.

The word that has now gone out of fashion is.....RESPECT.

Children as a whole tend not to respect their parents, respect the teachers and take health care and education for granted.

What can be done about it?

Corporal punishment at school and in the home if necessary.

[zebo]

I agree with the "some" comments but there is a link between poor parental attitude and poor performance and behaviour. When a child receives whatever punishment is still allowed, the good parent asks why, the poor one says immediately "I'll kill the b@@@@@@d" without knowing what happened. The latter child does not need to behave. Verbal abuse from parents and pupils is not uncommon and if a teacher physically intervenes to stop a fight, heaven help them. I once grabbed from behind the upper arms of a 16 year old girl, intent on slashing another pupil with a blade, the accusation was then that I had used excessive force because her arms were bruised. The school investigated that, not the original behaviour. I am so pleased to be retired, I would never encourage anyone into teaching and that's so sad, as the

[zebo]

(whoops, submit too soon)
the penny dropping moment, when a child suddenly realises they've "got it" is priceless.

[zebo]

Re Respect, at the risk of sounding a real old grump, did respect die when it became first names all round? I was in my late 50s when my mother died, but many of her neighbours were still Mr or Mrs to me, I would not dream of using their first names! Children today use first names for the friends' parents almost automatically, although oddly, my children's friends always used Mrs to me, because I was a teacher, although not their's!

[ToraToraTora]

I often still use surnames for old school colleagues, it's what we did naturally.

[Old_Geezer]

In the past lack of discipline in the home could be tackled by discipline in the classroom but that is clearly less easy since one can not longer say, "Boo", even to the little darlings.

No I'd not be a teacher. I don't get attracted to jobs where I'm likely find myself in horrible to experience situations, and barred from trying anything sensible to sort it.

[Old_Geezer]

"did respect die when it became first names all round?"
I doubt it. In fact I lost some respect for my physics teacher when I used his first name and he told me off for it. Although I do understand the difficulty is maintaining that teacher first, friend second relationship; but unless someone is doing something wrong there ought to be no coming down on them.

[Ellipsis]

> In the past lack of discipline in the home could be tackled by discipline in the classroom but that is clearly less easy [now]

Exactly.

[jno]

parents* are even turning up to school meetings in pyjamas these days, it seems. How the kids are supposed to learn respect for schools is beyond me.

*NO, NOT ALL OF THEM.