Doctors' Contract Set To Be Imposed

[mikey4444]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-35548091

This is ludicrous !

Does dave really think that he is doing us any favours here ! What happens if the Doctors refuse to accept this new contract ? Will he sack 10,000's of Doctors ?

He should step back from the brink, sack Hunt and appoint someone else.

[NellieMay]

Agree completely with Sqad! The junior doctors have argued that it will compromise safety. It will perhaps compromise their pockets! But safety will be improved.

[Bathsheba]

I agree with JTH,..hospitals are put under too much pressure since GP's made themselves almost unavailable to their patients.
I might also agree with old-geezer, but cba reading such a long answer ;)

[Old_Geezer]

Read one paragraph today, and another tomorrow, and so on until all is done. ;-)

[Bazile]

I haven't examined the details of the contract being pushed by the Government or indeed the arguments being put forward against it by the doctors .

What really concerns me is that we have a health service where i and my family and the wider public can be confident that if we are unfortunate enough to have an emmergency at the weekend ; that we can rest assured that the standard of treatment available will be at the same level , as throughout the week .

So come on The Government/ doctors ,keep trying to come to an amicable agreement that will provide that service and at the same time keep our talented people in this country and morale at a high level

[NellieMay]

What comes to mind is that Nye Bevan said that the NHS only came into being after his agreement to stuff consultants' mouths with gold! And now it would seem it's the unior doctors mouths. They are basically holding the NHS to ransom IMHO.

I also agree with JTH.

[NellieMay]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-35548091

Gives charts that makes things clearer!

[Bathsheba]

@ O-G...that sounds like a plan. Thanks :)

Baths
x x

[Old_Geezer]

Sooo... the charts show that the issue is mainly about being obliged to cover weekends; does that imply weekends are uncovered at present ? I find that difficult to believe but I suppose it's the obligation part that's the problem. Why not employ further staff to work the weekends, and let the weekly staff have a break ? Similarly for the 7pm to 8pm slot. Get evening/night staff to contract for evening/nights. Leave the rest as it is.

[viv41]

I too agree with JTH at 10:25.

[Sqad]

O_G

\\\\Why not employ further staff to work the weekends, and let the weekly staff have a break ?\\\

Where does one get these "further staff" from, qualified Drs don't grow on trees? In any case, those available would demand 3or 4 times normal rates of pay and my bet ,O_G is the Drs that are agitating about long hours, would be the first to offer to cover weekends and evenings and rake in 3 times the pay.

Don't underestimate Drs..........they are no fools.

[NellieMay]

Good idea Old Geezer, but then the Junior doctors day staff would be rebelling that they have no chance of overtime!!! It's simply all about money and nothing to do with safety!!

[NellieMay]

Exactly Sqad.

[Old_Geezer]

Same place they get them if they go sacking loads, or if the doctors resign.

If 4 times the present rate is the market value then maybe the existing doctors have a point about not being well treated.

Besides the NHS can not have been so foolish as to not train the number of doctors needed. They wouldn't rely on importing talent surely ? So there musty be sufficient trained doctors around here looking for a job. Even if it is just a shift or weekend one.

[youngmafbog]

This is all the cause of labour.

The lack of any sort of opposition is giving Cameron dictatorship.

[Sqad]

O_G

\\\Same place they get them if they go sacking loads, or if the doctors resign. \\

There are no spares.......there is no "slack" in the NHS and the above scenario will never come to be.

\\\\If 4 times the present rate is the market value then maybe the existing doctors have a point about not being well treated. \\\

No, no, locum Drs if that is what you mean are not entitled to holiday with pay, sick pay and their pay is not superannuable and that is why they are paid more....to compensate.

But O_G, the NHS is hemorrhaging money, many trusts are verging on bankruptcy..........this can't go on.

\\\So there musty be sufficient trained doctors around here looking for a job. \\\

You mean hanging around, turning up at the unemployment office, looking for work?............that isn't happening.

[anotheoldgit]

mikey4444

I wouldn't go on too much about the Tories, Labour has brought the Welsh NHS to it's knees.

http://www.sunnation.co.uk/how-labour-messed-up-the-welsh-nhs/

[bhg481]

If you have free prescriptions you have to get the money to pay for them from somewhere else.

[Old_Geezer]

If there is no slack then the problem is the same for both scenarios. You, like the management, are assuming that the staff will capitulate and you may be right, but it doesn't make it right. Anyway it'll be interesting to see how the BMA responds.

Meanwhile if there is a problem getting the staff that ought to be hired, surely that means that those trying for change should not be trying to do it immediately, they have failed to prepare for it. The sensible thing to do is take on the staff needed first and thus gradually bring the required staff in.

They shouldn't want locum doctors, but full time staff. This is part of the problem surely.

And I return to a previous point that other countries manage to find the budget so the NHS should be properly funded also. There is a case to look at what money is being spent on to ensure we are not trying to fund things that do not relate to basic medical care though.

You will be aware that the incredulity regarding training sufficient doctors was making a point that it probably hasn't happened. A total failure on the part of those managing the system. But even so I'm sure intelligent trained doctors would find alternative employment until an opening came up in their first choice profession.

[whiskeryron]

Is it not time to examine whether it would be feasible for the national lottery to help fund the NHS ? After all which is more important, funding for the arts & suchlike or our NHS ? Some of the prizes also seem to me to be OTT. Instead of whopping millions on offer what about 10 or 20 £ 1,000,000 single weekly prizes & again more money for a cash strapped NHS ?

[SlackAlice]

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/120753