Man Wins 'wheelchair V Buggy' Bus Case

[mikey4444]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-38663322

If this is the case that I remember, than common sense seems to have prevailed at last.

[andrew1707]

The Equality and Human Rights Commission (that funded this appeal) is not an EU institution. It was set up by the UK government... therefore leaving the EU will not make any difference to it.

[sunny-dave]

It's not black and white though, is it?

You have to let the bus driver have some leeway - there is a wealth of difference between :

1 . An elderly, frail, wheelchair user being unable to board the last bus for a couple of hours, because a stroppy mother won't move a child/buggy because it's a bit inconvenient

and

2. An otherwise perfectly fit, young, healthy, wheelchair user who would just have to wait ten minutes for the next bus, because a heavily pregnant, tired, mother physically can't cope with the ghastliness of folding/unfolding a buggy for the tenth time that afternoon.

It's a nonsense that it got to the Supreme Court - but common sense seems in short supply in 21st Century Britain.

[hereIam]

So glad he won.

[meglet]

Thanks to Sunny Dave for another point of view.

I have twins and a buggy that requires a reasonable effort and 2 hands to take down. I would have to pass both kids to strangers to collapse it and then perhaps carry them if there is no available seat. They weigh about 45lbs between them now. Should I be expected to give up a space for a wheelchair user?

[mikey4444]

Meglet....I doubt if you would be asked, under those circumstances.

Its not the passengers that need be effected by Court ruling. Its directed at the Bus Companies, who should have known better in the first place.

[vortex]

Meglet, a very fair and valid point.

[Tilly2]

Mikey, sorry about this but I do wish you would learn the difference between effect and affect. It makes you look daft, not knowing, and you are not daft.

[Caribeing]

Maybe it's time for buses to have a rear or side door with ramp towards the back of the bus so disabled passengers and babies buggies can board easily the seats at the front cause congestion buggies in aisles etc are a hindrance to pass by I travel by bus a lot and have had trouble passing down the aisle, recently two women with prams blocked other passengers getting by with buggies laden with shopping and the driver just drove on with passengers standing while back seats were empty.

[whiskeryron]

Take one double seat from buses & you can accommodate both, then only passengers who can stand for a short distance will be inconvenienced. Then once the disabled/buggy space is occupied, other disabled/buggies HAVE to wait for the next bus. ( where you have a situation that one wheel chair & one buggy are in place then the driver cannot allow another to board) fair or what ?

[New Judge]

SlackAlice has identified the problem perfectly:

“The court said the company should consider further steps to persuade non-wheelchair users to move, without making it a legal duty to move them. It ruled that FirstGroup's policy of requiring a driver to simply request a non-wheelchair user to vacate the space without taking any further steps was unjustified.”

What “further steps”, exactly? Just how can a bus driver “persuade” non-wheelchair users to move? Offer them a bag of sweeties? Free cinema tickets? Appeal to their better nature? Organise a show of hands amongst the other passengers? He can ask them and that’s that. That’s what the driver did in this case and his persuasion fell on deaf ears.

Prior to this it was up to the bus driver to decide if it was right that the baby buggy owner should give way to the wheelchair user and try to persuade them to do so. After this it will be up to the bus driver to decide if it was right that the baby buggy owner should give way to the wheelchair user and try to persuade them to do so. A colossal waste of money and a most unsatisfactory outcome. Buses were redesigned to provide a space for wheelchair users. The changes were not made to provide a space for mothers to wheel a buggy containing a child (or more often than not, containing her shopping).

“These seat are available only until a disabled/elderly person boards. “

It’s a space, actually, not seats. But anyway, no they are not. This very case was brought because a wheelchair user tried to board a bus when the space was occupied by a buggy. The bus driver tried to persuade the buggy user to move but she refused. The wheelchair user was left at the bus stop. As far as I can see this ruling changes absolutely nothing.

TfL (London) buses seem to adopt a more robust approach. Their signs say “You must give up this space if it is needed by a wheelchair user”. Quite what would happen in the event of a dispute similar to the one which caused this case is not clear.

“Should I be expected to give up a space for a wheelchair user?”

Yes because the space now available on most buses was designed for wheelchair users, not you.

[murraymints]

ggrrrr..today coming home on bus ..same scenario..girl with pram ..which could be folded..wee buggy thing...wheelchair came on and she wold not move..excuse me I said..let me help you fold your buggy so this gentleman can have this space.....in a LOUD voice...she got the message..buggy folded wheelchair in..everyone happy...hug from driver when I got off and pats on back fro other passengers,,,GGGGGRRR....

[hc4361]

Getting rid of the bus conductor was a huge mistake. Let the driver take charge of driving the bus while the conductor sorts out fares and passengers.

[vortex]

Reg Varney would have sorted any issues out himself ;-)

[Baldric]

Would you like an Olive with that?

[hc4361]

Only if the mother was a yummy mummy in a mini skirt.

[vortex]

LOL Baldric.

[murraymints]

balders ..showing age !

[woofgang]

In my local city, I have seen drivers refuse to move the bus from the stop until their request has been complied with. Of course its not always possible or successful but there are things that a driver can do.