Is Britain Really A Free Nation Or Democracy?

[vernonk]

In order not to apparently upset the legions of foreigners (yes, intended) particularly of a certain religion, allowed into Britain, it seems we are no longer free to say much of what we think and the UK's original religion Christianity is suppressed and gradually pushed out along with Christian celebrations such as Christmas and Easter. Sharia Law is increasingly allowed to exist alongside traditional British law. Only last year, Britain voted to leave the European Union, yet those who oppose that decision have been allowed to delay it and may yet overturn it. So is Britain really a free nation or democracy anymore, and will it ever return to being so?

[Kromovaracun]

Christmas and Easter seem to be doing just fine to me, even though the number of christians in the UK is declining massively (good thing imho, I wish British muslims would prove so eager to abandon their faith). Sharia courts are indeed an obstacle to freedom - but primarily for Muslim women. For that reason alone they should be disbanded. But they won't effect you if you're not a muslim.

It's not "foreigners" or muslims, though, who own gigantic daily newspapers and call upon the government to "crush the saboteurs" - meaning anyone who disagrees or questions the wisdom of the mob. It's not foreigners or muslims who use sinister fascist terms like "Enemy of the People" against anyone who doesn't bend to their will.

I take those far more seriously as threats to my freedom, because it brands me a traitor for having the wrong opinions.

[mikey4444]

Vernonk...lets nail one of your points stone dead first.

Christmas and Easter are not being "pushed out"....not even a little bit. Churches all over Britain were busy last weekend, as they are every Easter.

But the reason that churches are largely empty at other times of the year is nothing to do with the influence of non-Christian religions...its due to the apathy amongst our own indigenous population. If people want to go to a church service, and I don't, they can if they want to. Nothing is stopping them.

Some of those foreigners are actually helping helping some churches to stay solvent....ask the Parish Priest of my local Catholic church what he thinks about the pews being thronged by Polish immigrants, amongst others, every Sunday.

[vernonk]

Allen, nice idea but the mess Britain is now in is largely due to us sitting back and watching as it's turning into an Islamic state, with alarming rapidity. The rate at which Muslims are breeding suggests that Islam will only continue to rise here and most of the rest of the world. Yes, as you say, things have changed and people have come....but they ain't going away

[theshedman]

The one part of your question that hasn't been answered is about the remoaners trying to change the decision to leave the EU. If that was allowed to happen then it wouldn't be a democracy anymore as the majority voted to leave and then any vote would be open for change even a general election result. We don't always agree with the result but we have to abide by it or it would end up as mob rule. As I have said before, if the remoaners feel that deeply about staying in the EU then I have no objection what so ever if they decide to go and live in a country that wants to stay in the EU. Whether we were right or wrong in our decision will be seen in years to come but we must abide by the decision we made.

[thesshhh]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4383662/Muslim-births-overtake-Christian-births-two-decades.html

[thesshhh]

https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/10124/london-mosques-churches

[mikey4444]

This is just another anti-Muslim rant, in disguise.

[vernonk]

....and you look at those last two posts, Allen. Very interesting. Time to face facts

[anotheoldgit]

mikey4444

/// This is just another anti-Muslim rant, in disguise. ///

No not in disguise mikey, and why should it be? Islam is a very big problem not only in this country, but throughout the World, and anyone who disagrees with that fact must have their head buried deeply in the sand.

[Khandro]

mikey, it's time you and the other AB deniers wised up; the European population increased overall from 508.3 million to 510.1 million. Have you guessed why? The immigrant population increased, by about two million in one year, while the native European population was shrinking. It is the substitution of a population. The situation is as demographically as seismic as during the Great Plague of the 14th Century.

This shift is what the British demographer David Coleman described in his study, "Immigration and Ethnic Change in Low-Fertility Countries: A Third Demographic Transition." Europe's suicidal birth rate, coupled with migrants who multiply faster, will transform European culture. The declining fertility rate of native Europeans coincides, in fact, with the institutionalization of Islam in Europe and the "re-Islamization" of its Muslims.

This isn't a matter of opinion, as you seem to think, these are hard facts.

[kvalidir]

Good grief calm down, no-one has taken anyone's freedoms. You can still call and celebrate Christmas, Sharia Law doesn't apply to you and you can say what you like as long as it's not designed to incite racial or religious hatred- so how exactly are you hard done by?

[youngmafbog]

Sharia law does not apply to you - yet.

May not affect many of us but our children and grandchildren will be massively affected if we allow it to continue as it is.

[ichkeria]

Freedom is as much as anything else the freedom to complain about a lack of freedom and not be mysteriously disappeared or imprisoned.
There have never been more outlets for expression than there are now.

[youngmafbog]

//as long as it's not designed to incite racial or religious hatred//

And therein lies the problem. Whilst many would take a reasonable stance on that statement there are those(liberal left usually) who choose to interpret it as any statement or discussion on the topic is 'racist', xenophobic or one of many other words used. They then use these 'laws' to stifle a discussion they dont want to have.

[anotheoldgit]

kvalidir

You cannot say what you like, as many a person can confirm.

There are many who have been sacked for saying something that although not illegal, it may offend.

Why even on AB one cannot say what one likes, for fear of having one's post removed or even suspended, even if it has not broken any Site Rules.

[sp1814]

vernonk

Is Britain a free nation or democracy?

Yes.

But to dive deeper and answer your concerns, I think we need to look at what you're saying.

First of all, could you clarify what you mean when you say that Christmas and Easter are being 'suppressed and pushed out'?

I ask, because every single Christmas and Easter I can remember have been largely the same as the year before. Same turkey, Easter eggs, carol singers, Bond movie, crackers, bank holiday traffic, Queen's speech, card swaps, office secret Santa etc.

In what way has your festive season been suppressed?

You say that we are no longer free to say what we think about Muslims? I'm not sure that's true, especially when we consider the hundreds of thousands of websites that are openly critical of Islam as a religion and Muslims as a people.

Personally, I'm as concerned by Sharia Law as I am about Beth Din and Canon Law. Both of which have existed alongside civil law for centuries.

The truth is Jewish courts have functioned in Britain for centuries and the Catholic Church has the oldest continuously functioning legal system in the western world.

So how have people managed to abide by two sets of laws for all this time?

The answer is religious individuals have the right to practice their religion however they choose unless there is a British law against it. Which is pretty much common sense, praying = legal, wearing religious clothing = legal, training pigeons to attack atheists, probably illegal.

The decision to leave the EU is being fought against, I think in part, because the outcome of the referendum was so close. As Nigel Farage said last year - if the vote came down to 52% remain and 48% leave, UKIP would battle for a second referendum.

This is what's happening now, but the other way around.

It would have been so much better for the country if the Leavers got 70% of the vote, or the Remainers got 70%.

We needed a landslide.

[sp1814]

youngmafbog

In order to be bound by the decisions of religious courts, you have to be a follower of said religion.

This is why Catholic canonical laws and the Beth Din have little impact on you.

Same with Sharia Law.

[youngmafbog]

Yes, at present.

However once Islam takes over Western countries (their stated aim) then Sharia will replace the Nations law so I will have to abide by it. Or perhaps more likely being an atheist I wont have a head connected to my shoulders so I wont have to abide by it.