Should Children Be Indoctrinated Like This?

[Togo]

Over the years on here some of us have expressed the opinion, that our schools have become, just like the NHS and the BBC, hotbeds of Left wing and Marxist bias. Of course we are howled down and ridiculed by they who, although knowing it to be true, would prefer not to acknowledge it. Here is a man who should know. A betrayal of our children, and more akin to a Communist state or the Nazi propaganda program in the 30s.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-4705532/London-teacher-reveals-Left-brainwashing-children.html

[youngmafbog]

jno, have you ever really watched the BBC news and debate programs?

Or is it just that it fits or political agenda and you dont like the odd bit of 'balance' they pay lip service to?

Of course JRM put down to Dimbleby over Eton was classic. But also highlights the thinking behind the BBC.

[KARL]

It really is remarkable how easily people foam at the mouth at the fact that views/opinions contrary to their own exist. Is there really so much difficulty in simply noting a different angle/viewpoint and wondering if one's own is truly absolutely correct and therefore beyond the slightest need for modification ? But I will say that those who try to please everyone by never having (or at least never showing) any opinion/choice at all are the most disturbing.

[Baldric]

We do have a few Fence-sitters, they add very little imo.

[cassa333]

School does brainwash the children. And you can call it what you like from not brain washing to "like minded people gravitating together" it amounts to the same thing in the end when you are talking about the education of the young.

At the time of last years eu vote my children were 12.5 yrs old. They came home from school with how wonderful the EU was and why we should stay. The debate was all bout the benefits not the draw backs.

When asked if there was any discussion on leaving they said .. a bit but not much.

We then talked about the whole issue with them and for and against. They now see things differently from the propaganda they got in school.

TTT, you don't work with my brother do you? He came home with the very same thing said to his work. He is devestated at the outcome. The silly *** even said that because our dad came from souther Ireland when he was 19 (he became a British citizen and joined the Royal Marines) we would all get deported back to Dublin.

That coming from a highly intelligent airospace engineer.

[jim360]

Is it worth my pointing out that brainwashing (probably) isn't even a thing? Presenting only one side of a debate isn't actually brainwashing.

[Sqad]

Jim

" Presenting only one side of a debate isn't actually brainwashing."
I beg to differ.....it is "brain washing" if the opposing arguments are not presented with equal "enthusiasm".
If they are, then i would agree then it is not brain washing but "education."

[jim360]

Well, perhaps it's just pedantry on my part. Still, the point is that formally brainwashing includes what you do to the person rather than just what you tell them. If I present one side of the argument to someone then that is misleading them, rather than brainwashing them.

[Sqad]

LOL....right.

[jno]

I watched one once, ymb, but someone said something I disagreed with, so I had to switch off and write to my MP demanding my licence fee back.

But none of this is any surprise. The BBC recruits from exactly the same Oxbridge elite as the Tories do. How many former miners or trade union officials do you think they employ?

(Just to get you started: the current DG, Tony Hall, Baron Hall of Birkenhead, read PPE at Keble college, Oxford.)

[jim360]

Perhaps the key point is that someone who is brainwashed would have lost the ability to think for themselves. That's not what is happening to children in our schools, as I think everyone knows really. It's just convenient to call young people "brainwashed" because that saves the bother of having to try and engage with them.

[Sqad]

Jim

"Perhaps the key point is that someone who is brainwashed would have lost the ability to think for themselves."
Quite correct.

" That's not what is happening to children in our schools, as I think everyone knows really. "

That is the point of this tread...." everyone doesn't know."

I don't know, but my guess is that Politics is playing a greater part in school education than it has ever done. I wasn't taught Politics at all at school. I my opinion, the child is already "brainwashed" by it's parents and by local environmental "gossip" and experiences BEFORE it arrives at school.
No....Politics has no place in school education either by "indoctrination" or "balanced " debate.

[jim360]

"[In] my opinion, the child is already 'brainwashed' by [its] parents and by local environmental "gossip" and experiences BEFORE it arrives at school."

Makes you wonder why so many people are worried about school-based indoctrination, then.

Mostly I agree with you, in that children are shaped far more by what they learn at home than at school when it comes to politics. I am not sure this is a good thing, depending on how political debate is taught at school. I think it has a place there, as a useful counterbalance to home-based political learning.

[KARL]

Is it possible that those who complain of one-sidedness or brainwashing in schools (and elsewhere) are those who balked at modern religious education introducing the innocents to the existence of non-Christian faiths and even no faith at all ?

[jackthehat]

Teaching children things of which I approve/agee = Correct teaching.
Teaching children things of which I disapprove/disagree = Brainwashing.

And that it 'true' whichever side of the Political divide you sit.

[sunny-dave]

... and it doesn't work JtH, whichever way the bias is :+)

I had the (ahem) benefit of 7 years of a God Fearing, Tory Voting, Elite Generating education ... and quickly became an atheistic socialist ...

[Patsy33]

It's as bad as organised religion. So wrong.

[ToraToraTora]

jim:"Perhaps the key point is that someone who is brainwashed would have lost the ability to think for themselves" - I will admit to some hyperbole in the usage of the term "brainwashed" but these days there are undeniably a set of "correct" thoughts and attitudes that are pushed onto us all. Youngsters are perhaps more receptive to these but also many may not agree privately but hide those feelings because of societal bullying of those daring to stray from the publicly acceptable view on any given subject. In that sense children are at least programmed.

[ludwig]

Basically the BBC is criticised by lefties because it doesn't continually spout left wing propaganda, and critcised by right wingers because it doesn't continually spout right wing propaganda.

Lefties hate Laura Keunssberg because she doesn't constantly report how wonderful Jeremy is, and actually has the cheek to ask him awkward questions (Journalists eh! - how dare they ask questions?).

Perhaps we just need to grow up a bit, and accept that not everything (or even perhaps anything) is going to be presented in a way that complies 100% with our own personal opinions.

Sorry, that doesn't address the OP, but it did go off at a tangent.

[TheChair]

This "Teacher" is actually a Conservative politician, a vote leave team leader, and has held various positions in various conservative party organisations. He also has quite a career in writing articles in a similar vein for a number of right-wing newspapers.
As such, I would assume that he is at least as guilty of bias as those he accuses.
http://www.calvinrobinson.org/

[cassa333]

There isn't a big difference between
'What is being said doesn't fit with my beliefs therefore it is brainwashing bias' and 'I don't agree with you but you have come to your decision after unbiased debate and information sharing in an atmosphere of openness'.

I agree that what is said and done at home has an influence of the youngsters opinions but the bias by (what appears to be) a larger proportion of 'left leaning' teaching staff has to some Me degree a greater influence.

My children have come home saying a, b and c. And when I have pointed out that is wrong they have actually told me I am wrong as the teacher said it. Even when I guided them to the actual, real and identifiable and irrefutable right answer they still insisted the teacher was right.