Is It Not About Time The Eu Stepped In?

[youngmafbog]

During the referendum politicking we hear a lot about how the EU prevents wars. So where are they now when they are really needed to sort out the Spanish mess?

This could get out of hand well fast and will be detrimental to a lot of countries. The EU, headed by Junker, should be leading and at least aiding getting this sorted.

Perhaps Junker is still looking for the answer at the bottom of a bottle?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5023203/Catalonia-explode-violence-Madrid-imposes-rule.html

[Zacs-Master]

I don’t think there will be much if any violence. Don’t forget, there was only 43% turnout, indicating what the majority of them think of ‘their’ government’s wish to be independent.

[murraymints]

hmmm..passions are high ....

[Zacs-Master]

They’ll soon be quelled.

[murraymints]

with water cannon ?

[Zacs-Master]

If that’s what it takes, yes. The Guardia Civil don’t mess around.

[youngmafbog]

But surely ZM, one function of the EU is to hold it together?

These days the EU has gone far beyond just Economics. I would also dispute the EU does not interfere with a countries internal affairs. I am sure the good folks of Austria would agree with me!

[youngmafbog]

//Don’t forget, there was only 43% turnout//

Given there was expected violence, which did happen, that 43% figure is meaningless just as the supposed vote for Independence was meaningless. There will be quite a few I suspect who would vote out but are not willing to risk violence.

[Togo]

Filled up with fuel yesterday at a Shell garage. Nice lady hands me a promo card. Just enter this "special" code on Shell website to have a chance of a fabulous driving holiday in.....................Catalonia. Tank provided?

[Zacs-Master]

How can the fact that 57% of Catalan people not turning out to vote be Meaningless?
If it was the violence of their would be independent government’s supporters which put some of them of then that speaks volumes. If it was the fact that some of them didn’t want independence, that also speaks volumes.
What would you put it down to?

[Zacs-Master]

Togo, I think the press reports (as per) are giving an exaggerated view of the situation. I’m pretty sure that for the vast majority of people it’s business as usual, especially in rural areas.

[youngmafbog]

OK, so you dont think that the threat of violence (from the Police) put anyone off?

You dont think that Police blocking polling stations put anyone off?

You do think that everyone who would vote for Independence voted?

Are my assumptions of your opinion correct?

[Zacs-Master]

I think your not reading a word of what I wrote YMB.

I’ve said that the violence put off a lot of potential NO voters. I actually wrote that.

If you didn’t want independence, why would you bother pushing past police barricades to vote in an illegal referendum?

I’ve no idea what an assumption of an opinion actually is. Or whether it’s actually a thing at all so I’ll refrain from answering whatever it is you meant.

[mikey4444]

Minty..when I suggested that a few days ago, I was howled down !

But when there are plenty of other places to visit, why take a chance with this part of Spain ?

It seems to me that the Catatonian separatists haven't thought this through. When they did have their unofficial Refn. a few days ago, it was hardly overwhelmingly for independence. Did they really think that Madrid would just back down ?

I think both sides should calm down and ask for a neutral mediator for help, before its too late and lives are lost.

[youngmafbog]

//I’ve said that the violence put off a lot of potential NO voters. I actually wrote that. //

And it undoubtedly put off a number of yes voters.

Hence why I say that 43% is meaningless. One way or the other.

[youngmafbog]

I agree totally and utterly with your last sentence Mickey. It's what I mean about the EU, both sides want to belong to it so surely the EU could step in with an offer of mediation.

[Zacs-Master]

But that’s not what they do. They aren’t equipped with the departments to mediate in such circumstances and never intended nor desired to be.
Again, you have a very strange view of what the EU’s role is.

[Zacs-Master]

So, YMB, say your counties council decides it wants independence but you vehemently disagree with it plus, the Govt has declared it illegal, but despite this they hold a referendum, would you vote in said referendum?

[Old_Geezer]

It's not the backing down, it's what to do and keep the moral high ground. Little point dismissing a government if it is an area that is debatably no longer part of your country because they have declared independence. Either you use force to get your way, or you lose the area. On the other hand use force and it creates the same attitudes the violent prevention methods for the vote had.

BTW One doesn't have to sneer at the EU's claim to have maintained peace, it is manifest that it doesn't do anything of the sort. Economics and joint interests do; which means trade agreements and a desire to ensure no trading partner falls into too much difficulty that they start to feel put upon and to resent their neighbours. Sovereign control by an EU over one's nation can only generate ill feeling; even if those members receiving more than they contribute might feel inclined not to make a fuss.

[Zacs-Master]

I’m what way is Spain going to lose the area, OG?

[Zacs-Master]

In what way.....