Out Go The Moderate Labourites Then?

[youngmafbog]

The hard left tighten their hold on Labour.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5270715/Momentum-chief-Lansman-elected-Labour-ruling-committee.html

[davegosling]

Spiralling into obscurity! Whatever you think of Blair, he knew how to win elections, and this wasn't it.

I understand the "Old Labour" mentality perfectly - I grew up with it - but the world today is a very different place. Idealism is all very well, but idealism without realism is little more than cloud-cuckoo-land.

[Kromovaracun]

I think it's a bit odd to suggest Eddie Izzard is a "moderate" Labour supporter, as the Mail does. I'm quite glad he didn't get in - having seen his performances on Question Time I don't think he comes over as an especially clear voice of reason.

I really hope this doesn't lead to re-selections as I think that will actually play very badly for them. Unfortunately the atmosphere in the Party is one of mistrust at the moment as it was in open civil war about 18 months ago. So it is probably likely, alas. And we'll end up with a party full of loyalist patsies like Daniel Zeichner.

[ToraToraTora]

it's ok mikey will still vote for them!

[Kromovaracun]

I think another problem (highlighted at the bottom of the Mail article) is that so many of the Labour moderates seem to fixated on "stopping a Tory hard Brexit", when the leadership is fundamentally not interested in that. I also think a message like that would make Labour seem like it was desperate to re-run the Brexit referendum, which virtually nobody wants.

If they argued instead for something positive like "Let's have the Norway option", that would be a more coherent and frankly less whiney message than "stop Tory hard Brexit", which seems to be what the party moderates have rallied around now.

[ichkeria]

Although on the other hand Jon Lansman is a prominent Jewish member of the "anti-semitic" Labour party, and also has just, I believe, disbanded or disenfranchised the momentum youth wing

[Jackdaw33]

The fact that they are on the NEC is irrelevant. Far more insidious is their infiltration of local parties where they can select or deselect MPs at will. This is just a rerun of what the Militant Tendency did in the late 70s and 80s.

[youngmafbog]

I'd tend to agree on Izzard but the real thing is that Momentum have a hold. Surely that cannot be good for Labour. As DG has pointed out times have changed workers have rights and many own their own homes etc. Unless Labour wants to be the Party of the unemployed I really dont know why it is doing this.

We now have no Liberal Party to speak of anf a Labour Party heading for far left extremism.. Where is the choice at the ballot box?

[youngmafbog]

The difference then though Jack is that there was massive unrest in the workforce caused by Unions and pi?? poor management. With a few exceptions that is not the case now.

And we dont have the Stawbs playing the background either.

[Jackdaw33]

//Where is the choice at the ballot box?\\

You know the answer to that, YMF - vote Tory.

[emmie]

makes disturbing reading, so Lansman wants to be part of a socialist party again, the one he joined 44 years ago, will Labour under Corbyn be a safe bet to win the next election with these people in tow.

[Kromovaracun]

//We now have no Liberal Party to speak of anf a Labour Party heading for far left extremism.. Where is the choice at the ballot box?//

Nowhere. We do not live in a well-designed democracy. Our electoral system is antiquated and has robbed people of meaningful choice for at least a century. Indeed, that is rather the point of a FPTP electoral system.

[mikey4444]

Lansman was elected democratically. And the Labour vote and Membership of the Party has increased under the Leadership of Corbyn.

Not sure what is exactly wrong here then ?

I know Polls are not to be relied on these days but in this Poll, Labour is ahead in seats :::

http://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/homepage.html

[ToraToraTora]

mikey: "Not sure what is exactly wrong here then ?" - you must remember the early 80s, the last time Labour was strangulated by the hard left, remember Kinnochio's battle with Degsy and co? Good old days eh mikey?

[mikey4444]

All in the past TTT....30 years ago !

The Election in June saw how popular Labour policies could be, and the rise in Labour popularity has increased since then.

The reality, as has been pointed out earlier in this thread is the people are faced with only two alternatives, and the Tory one now appears to be in decline, along with Tory Party Membership.

The SNP is the only other choice, and that will always be anti-Tory.

[Jackdaw33]

The fact of the matter is that communists, realising that they have no hope of being elected, infiltrate the Labour Party with a view to imposing their own agenda. It's called entryism, a strategy of which Lenin would have heartily approved.

[davegosling]

"The SNP is the only other choice"

Only in Scotland!

[Jackdaw33]

Back in the 70s, when the SNP first surfaced, they were dismissed by Labour as 'Tartan Tories'. How come they've changed?

[mikey4444]

Rubbish Jack !

Its the Tories that need to buck their ideas up, and as long as they are in a state of complete shambles, then the situation will remain the same.

[mikey4444]

Yes Dave, and the SNP lost votes in June !

[Jackdaw33]

I do not think it's rubbish. It is a matter of record that in the early days the SNP was seen to be a right-wing nationalist party. Today it appears to be very much to the left of Labour. All I'm querying is the sudden change of ideology.