So Now Even May Has Joined Project Fear

[Jackdaw33]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46772601

This wretched woman must go, and go quickly.

[jim360]

What do you mean, "now"?

[aelmpvw]

i'd assumed that she was the instigator of project fear

[dannyk13]

She's a founder member.

[Zacs-Master]

Yes, strange question. She’s a pro EU PM in charge of a majoritarialy pro EU Govt.

[kvalidir]

Basically you mean people are actually starting to sober up and realise exactly what we are proposing doing? Some of us were never drunk in the first place.

[New Judge]

All we re proposing to do, kval, is to join the 150 or so other non-EU countries around the world by controlling our laws, money, borders and trade. None of that can be achieved whilst we are EU members nor can it be regained if Mrs May's "leaving" agreement is accepted. You don't have to be drunk to want that.

[Rockrose]

Or perhaps she is trying to make sure that when this shower of poo hits we are at least a little prepared

[kvalidir]

Well then NJ, it'll all be super duper and hunky dory if it happens won't it? So why the 'project fear' monicker? Why is it even news? If the hardliners are to be believed we'll leave, we'll flourish stupendously, everyone will stop for afternoon tea at 4.00pm, Rule Britannia will be joyfully sung in taverns whilst watching the local Morris Dancers, there won't be any violent crime, immigration will be magically solved, church bells will ring of a Sunday mornin' and we'll all sigh contentedly whilst lovingly stroking our lovely Blue passports. Elysium indeed. Or not.

[Khandro]

Kval. //Some of us were never drunk in the first place.//

Some of us remember life before the EU too, there was such a thing you know, and it was fine.

[dannyk13]

Perhaps Kval is too young to remember when we were Great Britain.

[kvalidir]

Yes, yes I am, however my 'Remainer' Grandmother and all of her 80 years isn't. Plenty of people can remember pre EU membership and voted stay. We can make this about age if you like, but I personally wasn't planning on being rude enough to do that, but happy to join in if you fancy it?

[New Judge]

"If the hardliners are to be believed we'll leave, we'll flourish stupendously, everyone will stop for afternoon tea at 4.00pm, Rule Britannia will be joyfully sung in taverns whilst watching the local Morris Dancers, there won't be any violent crime, immigration will be magically solved, church bells will ring of a Sunday mornin' and we'll all sigh contentedly whilst lovingly stroking our lovely Blue passports. Elysium indeed."

Who said any of that then? Or is that simply the impression you have constructed? Incredible as it may seem countries which are not members of the EU manage to thrive incredibly well. And they don't sing "Rule Britannia" whilst supping afternoon tea. But I think those arguments (together with the fatuousness that often accompanies them) are long gone.

[kvalidir]

Fair enough I was being fairly facetious however Brexiteers can hardly slate the rest of us for pointing out the colossal balls up that the whole of Brexit has become, including leaving with a no deal.

[gulliver1]

Kvalidir 14.45, SPOT ON,

[jim360]

Before joining the EC, wasn't the UK known as the "Sick Man of Europe"? Our economy was stagnating and generally speaking progress was far slower than any European or even global rivals. We'd gradually slipped back from being relevant in foreign matters, too.

So I'm not sure that those remembering the time before the EU are really correct to say that it was "fine" -- perhaps satisfactory, but hardly brilliant. It's generally accepted that joining the EU has been beneficial for the UK's economy, and as part of a larger whole it could also have given us greater relevance globally. Most foreign nations deal with, and are happy to deal with, the EU, rather than its constituents.

It is therefore, at the very least, debatable that the pre-EU UK was "fine".

[dannyk13]

Kval, I was not making this about age.Just passing a comment that maybe you have nothing to compare the difference between being a free nation and being subjugated to the EU.

[kvalidir]

Well you could also say that about Welsh Nationalists and Scots Nationalists or people who want a United Ireland, or Basque Separatists etc etc etc ad infinitum.
If we are all to only have opinions about that which we've personally experienced then we'd all better shut up now about pretty much everything.

[dannyk13]

Kval, or about people who spend most of their time in the US.

[Khandro]

jim
'In the waning days of the Ottoman Empire, Tsar Nicholas of Russia dubbed the ailing state “the sick man of Europe.” This mid-19th century turn of phrase soon proved useful in other contexts, and was duly applied to other countries. Some 160 years later, in September 2015, Finland’s finance minister lamented that “basically, we are the sick man of Europe.”'
Nearly every country in Europe has been dubbed the sick man of Europe at one time or another. After the UK it was Germany at the moment it's being applied to Italy.
The UK's losing of the title had nothing solely to do with the EU

[ichkeria]

"All we re proposing to do, kval, is to join the 150 or so other non-EU countries around the world by controlling our laws, money, borders and trade."

I very much doubt if it can be said that the countries of the world outside the EU all control their own borders and trade. Certainly trade-wise, "controlling one's own" is pretty much a myth.
Did you know we'll be the first country after March 29, should no transitional trade agreement with the EU be in existence, to rely entirely on WTO trade rules. OK the WTO has not been in existence all that long, but that record may well extend back to GATT, possibly even the ITO