Turkey Turns On The Kurds

[Bobbisox1]

These brave warriors took on Daesh and riddled Syria of the scum, now Turkey is bombing Northern Syria as the world just watches
Short memories

[youngmafbog]

The usual Trump haters on here I see.

[ichkeria]

I certainly don’t support this invasion. On the other hand to Turkey, having a Kurdish controlled southern border is a threat to their security. There are so many competing interests in the Syrian quagmire.

[ichkeria]

As for Trump: this is either a serious error on his part or complicity.
Either way it looks bad.

[Spicerack]

He was going to start wars everywhere, Naomi, including WW3.
Now, every time he doesn't start a war he's a bar steward.
How far could US troops go in defending themselves against a member of NATO? (they'd love to blame that one on Trump)
I don't like Erdogan at all but he can claim some kind of justification in creating a buffer zone on his border.
US troops are 7,000 miles from home, UK 3,500 miles and no-one invited them. What justification do they have to be there? (if anyone says fighting IS, they're going to the bottom of the class)

[retrocop]

Looks like Mr Erdogan is threatening us with more immigrants and are attempting to release Daesh prisoners.

Meanwhile Trump says he has a number of Daesh in custody,including the last two 'Beatles' who will stand trial in America. At least a bit of good news.

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/turkeys-erdogan-threatens-send-millions-104738806.html

[Ellipsis]

A NATO country is attacking the Kurds who helped the Americans take on ISIS in Syria. The Kurds are abandoning the ISIS prisons to defend themselves. Everything's fine, obviously!

I thought this summed it up nicely ...

11,000 Kurds died fighting ISIS and now the US is abandoning them — who will help America next time?
https://www.businessinsider.com/military-leaders-warn-trump-abandoning-ally-grave-mistake-2019-10
When Trump originally declared that he was pulling US troops from Syria in late 2018, Secretary of Defense James Mattis resigned, saying the president deserved a defense secretary who shared his views. In his recent book "Call Sign Chaos: Learning To Lead," Mattis wrote of his decision to resign: "When my concrete solutions and strategic advice, especially keeping faith with allies, no longer resonated, it was time to resign, despite the limitless joy I felt serving alongside our troops in defense of our Constitution" — the allies, in this case, reportedly being the Kurds.

[pixie374]

I keep seeing the title here, and thinking it is a Christmas dinner thread by ttt :-)

[ichkeria]

I’m very much on the side of the Kurds here.
However: they didn’t of course fight IS to help us. When the civil war in Syria started the Kurds wisely - craftily perhaps - stayed out of it. Because of that, Assad thought he could divert his troops from Kurdish areas to conduct his genocidal war on his own people elsewhere. This gave the Kurds the chance to assert control in their areas through their own militias. And when IS struck in Kobani to launch their “caliphate” it was the Kurds who were best placed to fight them and become a key ally of the west.
They won’t be the first group in Syria to feel badly let down by their Western allies.

[jourdain2]

Erdogan is coming out in his true colours now, but I feel very strongly that the Kurds have been betrayed and that echoes and resentments will, understandably, resound for many years to come. The only good bit is that now no-one can pretend about Erdogan. Very, very saddened.

[david small]

History is again repeating itself. Will we never learn?

[jourdain2]

It seems not, david small. I'm currently reading 'The Second World War' by Antony Beevors (heavy going, but I recommend it) and the parallels are horrifying.

[jim360]

This isn't a Trump Hater moment. He's been condemned for his part in this across the board, even from some of his strongest allies in the Republican party. It shouldn't be a matter of politics. People in the Kurdish region are being attacked two days after the US pulls out. Trump has made a catastrophic error of judgement. I don't deny that it's easier for me to reach that position than it would an ally, but when people like Lindsey Graham are saying the same sort of thing then that should make Trump's supporters on this site sit up and listen, if not to me then to him.

It's not, I don't think, to compare this to the Munich Agreement. Not because of the longer-term consequences of that -- I can give Erdogan the credit at least that he's only interested in destroying the Kurds -- but it is similar in the short-term consequences. The Kurds, like the Czechoslavakians before them, have been sold out horribly because the US (or UK) would rather wash their hands of foreign affairs. It's disgusting. And it's rather sad that some people can't see past the "Trump-haters" label in this case. If I want to show my hatred for Trump then I'd talk about comparatively trivial affairs.

And no, I don't think anyone can take seriously the idea that Turkey would have attacked if US troops would have still been present, when two days after they leave the attack that must have been planned for months or years is launched.