Covid Mortality Figures A Farce.

[retrocop]

If you are run over by a bus today and die and you tested positive for Covid 19 back in February then your death is reported as Covid related death by PHE. If this is true then it makes a mockery of almost anything our so called 'experts' are shovelling down our throats. It seems like spreading alarm and despondency for some sinister purpose.

https://metro.co.uk/2020/07/17/matt-hancock-calling-urgent-review-exaggerated-coronavirus-death-toll-13002134/?ito=push-notification&ci=23329&si=9444196

[riptide]

Well it only alters the death figures, they still had the virus

[Gizmonster]

I heard this quite a while ago and agree - if it is true, then the figures are way out and like you say, what's behind it all?

[fiction-factory]

Are there covid carriers who get killed by buses? Only small percentage of the population have had covid so only a small percentage of those killed by buses/car accidents/suicide for example will have covid. Can't see it changing the total by much, but it does show why excess deaths is the better measure in the longer run- and that is what the scientists have said all along

[fiction-factory]

and remember , the figures for covid death only count those who had been tested positive for Covid. There will be people run over by buses who had covid but hadn't been tested.
Anyway whether the figure is 45000 (tested, with Covid) or 40000 (of Covid) or 65000 (excess deaths) doesn't change the fact that the numbers are huge and would have been higher without social distancing, isolation, Nightingale hospitals, lockdowns, etc

[retrocop]

ff

Forget buses if you wish to take it literally. You die of pancreatic cancer or senile dementia,motor neurone disease and have tested positive months ago you still end up as a covid statistic. Christ on a crutch . How easy to cover up deaths by foul play by just writing it off as a Covid death.

[teacake44]

Bet he don't call an urgent review on PPE. :0)

[teacake44]

May be when he/she was crossing the road they sneezed due to having covid, and didn't see the bus coming.

[dannyk13]

Retro, the figures are still valid for people who have/had Covid19.I agree they are not valid as a cause of death.

[fiction-factory]

If anything the covid figures understate the impact though retrocop- just look at the excess mortality data. And if Covid expedites the death of a cancer sufferer or motor neurone disease (say brings it forwards by 12 months) are you saying that we shouldn't count those deaths? By your argument the figure should be nil really because we'll all die of something eventually

[kettledrum]

You don't even have to be tested positive for Covid. 3 of my friends have had elderly, frail and seriously ill parents die in the last 3 months with no suggestion that they were suffering from Covid ever. But, nonetheless that is the cause of death shown on death certificate.

[SteveD]

I would like to see the figures January to July 2019 deaths (all causes) vs January to July 2020 deaths (all causes).

[fiction-factory]

The figures don't count what's on the death certificate- the figures are deaths where the person had a positive covid test. They probably understate Covid deaths as some wouldn't have been etsted

[fiction-factory]

steved- the figures on excess mortality are published by ONS regularly but there is a time lag- I'm not sure we have figures for June yet. If I get time I'll look. Last time I saw the fires it was something like 60000 more deaths in first 5 months- around 50% higher than the Covid reported deaths figures. Someone may have the true data

[jim360]

Steve:

https://www.ons.gov.uk/file?uri=%2fpeoplepopulationandcommunity%2fbirthsdeathsandmarriages%2fdeaths%2fdatasets%2fweeklyprovisionalfiguresondeathsregisteredinenglandandwales%2f2020/publishedweek272020.xlsx

https://www.ons.gov.uk/file?uri=%2fpeoplepopulationandcommunity%2fbirthsdeathsandmarriages%2fdeaths%2fdatasets%2fweeklyprovisionalfiguresondeathsregisteredinenglandandwales%2f2019/publishedweek522019.xls

[Peter Pedant]

// Forget buses. You die of pancreatic cancer or senile dementia,motor neurone disease and have tested positive months ago you still end up as a covid statistic.//

a cop dont know narfin about death certification - and how many years were you in the force? best ask a doctor-SQAAAAD!

does one cause of death preclude another ? nope is the short answer (*)

but to continue - as I have lymphoma ( quietly ) and I get covid and die - - do I die from covid or lymphoma ( short answer bofe)

and yippee boys if it is covid then my consultant onco can claim a cure for his dept!

my choice is mode of death is covid and
contirbuting cause is lymphoma

not rocket science and didnt I say a fe months ago that research using death certs was riven with problems

wind down your outrage ABers and get on with the rest of your lives

[Peter Pedant]

(*) altho in a hospital I have heard more than one very senior doctor with very good results exclaim - oh he is not my patient I was only consulting - he may die!

which is kinda a gloss that you doan ask the senior doctor if he is a good doctor ( er answer always yes) you ask his staff

[pastafreak]

This might be of interest to some...

https://www.cebm.net/covid-19/why-no-one-can-ever-recover-from-covid-19-in-england-a-statistical-anomaly/

[Peter Pedant]

FF we have been going around in circles for the last few months
One stat school was running very strongly with the idea that no one is dying from covid they are just dying sooner from their underlying disease. NJ was keen keen keen on this idea

disproven by the excess mortality curve
BUT as J M Keynes said - we are all dead in the long run
and so it depends on when your future cut off is
they wd have died in three month anyway or six months anyway

there is nothing like being wrong
sweden was high on the whiners' agenda because NOTHING had happened when they didnt close the schools. The swedes now are investigating why they bucked obviously good advice and let the disease run rampant

ho hum - life goes on for a lot of us

[teacake44]

Hancock just gearing up for the enquiry ( that they won't call for an urgent review) and to find has many excuses for the death rate being off the scale. Considering that Boris has all ready stated that this is not the time for (any) such enquiries, Hancock is breaking his neck to get this one going. I bet he will work day and night on this one.