Colston Vandals Cleared

[fender62]

the judge just greenlighted it's ok to vandalise, if you don't like a statue or painting just knock it down or rip it up, history is there to be trodden on if it offends you...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10371949/BLM-protestors-not-guilty-criminal-damage-toppling-Edward-Colston-statue-Bristol.html

[pixie374]

Danny, that isn't what Jim's link gives as the definition.

[dannyk13]

Gromit, the Government is not saying that th4e verdict was wrong.They are looking at the judge's direction to the jury with a view to obtaining a clarification of the law for any charges of a similar type.
If you read my link you will get a better explanation of this.

[dannyk13]

Pixie
https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/criminal-damage
Scroll down to 'meaning of damage'.

[mushroom25]

// capable of putting things in a compelling manner to sway the jury (which is is job after all). //

the legal system in this country, when it reaches court, is grand theatre. no better evidenced than by a friend who was observing a trial of someone alleged to have been a member of an armed gang, who was caught having run away from the bank (that was robbed). the alleged fleeing criminal stated that he was desperate for a s***.

when the arresting officer was cross examined, the exchange went something like:-

barrister: having apprehended mr x, did you evidence his having been to the toilet? did you seek and find his deposit?
police officer: no I did not.
barrister: can we assume, then, that you'd already decided mr x was guilty?

[dannyk13]

Naomi, sorry, I missed that.

[pixie374]

Thanks, Danny. Not quite the same as the link, though. I'm not giving an opinion, just trying to see what happened.
So, it wasn't "criminal" as it was part of a "peaceful protest"?

[Gromit]

dannyk13

Government meddling.
Who is going to ask for a retrial? The local Council? They have already wasted enough public money on this.

[jno]

pixie, we don't know why exactly the jury decided as they did, and rightly so - jury room discussion is meant to be private. But this link Jim provided a few pages back explains a possible rationale

https://thesecretbarrister.com/2022/01/06/do-the-verdicts-in-the-trial-of-the-colston-4-signal-something-wrong-with-our-jury-system-10-things-you-should-know/

[pixie374]

Thanks jno, that was the only part I had properly read... it doesn't seem to include other potential criminal damage, in future. But suggests, why this technically, wasn't.

[dannyk13]

Pixie, it was criminal.If you read the first part of my link it defines what is criminal damage.

[jno]

jury decisions never set precedents, pixie, only judge's decisions can do that. So if other statue people from Bristol or elsewhere came up in court, another jury's decision might be completely different.

[dannyk13]

Gromit //Who is going to ask for a retrial? //
Nobody, which you would have known if you had read either Naomi's or my link.

[pixie374]

I know, jno.... that was from scanning the thread, and some suggestions that "criminal damage" is now legal. Which it obviously isn't.
Danny, the "criminal" part in the link, is suggesting you have to prove an "unlawful" reason. And as far as I can see, it was decided it was part of a protest and free speech... so that is the part, not proven?

[dannyk13]

Pixie, the demonstration might have been lawful but the did not have a lawful excuse for pulling the statue down and it was damaged. I stick by their actions meeting the definition of criminal damage.

[dannyk13]

It will be interesting to see the outcome of the Attorney General's appeal.

[pixie374]

Ok, Danny, thanks.

[Gromit]

// It will be interesting to see the outcome of the Attorney General's appeal. //

She hasn’t appealed it yet. She is only ‘considering’ appealing it.

Once the angry Tory MPs move on to the next thing to knee jerk against, she may not bother. It would be fairly pointless and a waste of money.

[Atheist]

fender and the rest of like mind:- you lost, get over it. :-)
(Now, does that sound familiar?)

[royfromaus]

Lefties will never condemn lefty idiots smashing stuff up.

It's a disease.

[naomi24]

Atheist, what are you talking about? What do you think Fender lost?