The Ulez Situation.............

[10ClarionSt]

...........isn't going to win anyone any votes. Even if the court had ruled against Mad Sad Khan, the whole thing would have just been used for road charging based on usage. What happened to the development of anti-pollution measures? Remember lead-free petrol? That was going to be a big help to reduce vehicle emissions. But hold on, it gets better! There is now the Catalytic Converter. This will be an even bigger help to reduce vehicle emissions. But hold on again! We now have Ad Blue, for diesel vehicles. Sorted! Much lower and less harmful emissions that are surely making lots of money for a few people. Trouble is, according to Mad Sad Khan, over 4,000 deaths a year in London are caused by vehicle emissions; something that he cannot prove and neither can anyone else. I haven't followed the recent case but I wonder if anyone challenged Mad Sad in court to provide proof of Monty Python type statement

[naomi24]

He didn't implement this.

[douglas9401]

Odd, Johnson's not known for low emissions.

[sp1814]

naomi24

What? The expansion to the outer boroughs? Moot point - if ULEZ worked under Johnson, then Khan is simply bringing the benefit of more Londoners.

But the fact is - ULEZ was introduced to London by Tory Mayor Boris Johnson.

[webbo3]

1 death according to this.
https://ibb.co/8MydPTP

[sp1814]

naomi24

See section 7.1:

http://erg.ic.ac.uk/research/home/resources/ERG_ImperialCollegeLondon_HIA_AQ_LDN_11012021.pdf

[naomi24]

SP, ULEZ didn't 'work under Johnson' at all. Johnson's plan was to introduce it in 2020 to Central London only in - by which time Khan had taken office as Mayor. Khan introduced it earlier, and then extended it, and is again extending it. You can twist and shout all you like, but this must be laid firmly in Khan's court.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultra_Low_Emission_Zone#:~:text=Sadiq%20Khan%2C%20the%20subsequent%20mayor,Circular%20and%20South%20Circular%20roads.

[sp1814]

The ONS figure only includes the death of Ella Kissi-Debrah because she was the first (and so far only) person to have air pollution listed as contributory factor in her cause of death.

The Imperial College report seeks to establish how levels of pollution in London are a contributory factor not only in excess deaths, but also how it affects life expectancy - something that would be difficult for individual coroners to calculate

Also, on a wider note. There has been one case of air pollution being recorded as a contributory factor in the death of a child.

At what number of deaths do we need to get to per year before something is done?

[sp1814]

naomi24

ULEZ works.

https://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/231894/london-pollution-improved-with-evidence/

It works so well that it's being extended.

The report states that ULEZ alone isn't a silver bullet and that effective pollution reduction will depend on a range of initiatives.

But ULEZ definitely works.

[Togo]

Webbo posted the link to the 1 death, that must now be used to affect millions. The report says ...
"There was 1 death registered in London in the period 2001 to 2021 which had air pollution recorded on the death certificate in either Part 1 or Part 2 of the death certificate. This death was attributed to environmental air pollution, however we are unable to determine whether this involved car emissions."

Pretty straight forward then. Not attributed to car emissions. Did the child's parents smoke anything? Did the poor child suffer with other co morbidities? 1 death in a period of 20 years that is now the beacon for the over emotional and hard of comprehension and a chance to make millions of lives almost untenable for Londoners or the businesses that are needed to keep the place crawling along.

[naomi24]

//a chance to make ......//

.... a hell of a lot of money!

[sp1814]

Togo

That's from the ONS. The expansion of ULEZ isn't based on that, it's based on the work of Imperial College London.

[Togo]

You raised the case as some sort of justification for ulez. Remind us again what it was about the child's death that so caused your heartfelt concern. If ulez is not about lessening the death rate from 1 every 20 years then what is it about? Is it about control and revenue?

[Zacs-Master]

And being seen to do the right thing on the global stage.

[Gromit]

The lead in petrol did not produce more green house gases, it put LEAD into the air. It was taken out of petrol for other reasons - it was poisonous to humans.

Catalytic Converters have a flaw in that they only work effectively on long journeys. In towns and cities wehre the traffic is constantly stop starting, they are useless. The Government have stopped funding them for London buses because they don’t work.

All those pollution reducing measures have not had the desired results. The air quality in London is terrible and dangerous to the people who live there. So something else needs to be tried.

[Zacs-Master]

‘ The Government have stopped funding them for London buses because they don’t work’

‘There are 3,835 hybrid buses, 950 battery electric buses, and 20 hydrogen fuel cell buses operating in London, as of March 2023, out of a total bus fleet of 8,643’
Src: Wiki.

[retrocop]

Khan's implementation of ULEZ has been extended to a 600 square mile area. Has Greater London grown that big and does he have the authority over the home counties that are expected. People /drivers are being squeezed like pips just to fill Khan's empty coffers. If you think you are on a winner to purchase an electric car you will find you will soon be required to pay VED which up to now is exempt. At a later date you will find that pay per mile will apply for all cars. Then it will be the 15 minute journey. This tin pot hypocrite is on a roll now.. He want's to encourage the use of public transport yet is cutting back on many bus routes in all the London boroughs because he has bankrupted TfL. If you want to experience real air pollution just get a rattler on the underground system. Tested and proven to be the worst pollution in London. If he was really concerned about respiratory illness then why has he not cleaned up his own act. He want's to screw people out of their money not spend any.
The zone affects thousands of car drivers who live in outer London like Biggin Hill. Fields ,Farms and Fresh air abound just as other outlying districts of London such as Herts and Beds. These people do not enjoy the same public transport as central London has. They rely on their vehicles to take kids to school, hospital or GP appointments, shopping etc and if not compliant pay £12.50 per day for the privilege. Highway robbery.
BTW. What is a premature death. People say," oh he wasn't very old when he died. No age at all". The deceased dies at 75 years old and been a heavy smoker for 59 of them. Possibly mature adults die because their lungs were damaged as young children by being bought up from birth with heavy smokers as parents.

[sp1814]

What SHE said!

https://twitter.com/marinapurkiss/status/1685253874498555904?s=46&t=ut4EGtcg_YdDrd5ue_if3w

[naomi24]

You know the old expression .... well, SHE would say that, wouldn't she. Any port in storm - even an untenable one.

[sp1814]

Togo

You wrote:

"You raised the case as some sort of justification for ulez. Remind us again what it was about the child's death that so caused your heartfelt concern."

Except I didn't. Look at the thread again - webbo3 first referenced the case of Ella Kissi-Debrah. I was only responding to that post.

My views are based on the findings of the report from Imperial College.

[sp1814]

nomi24

Mixed metaphors ahoy!