Munchausen's By Proxy???

[beryllium]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_styl e/health/article2610704.ece

Is this woman on the verge of a nervous breakdown? or other?

Will Katie understand why??? she's about to be put through a major operation.... that even a normal healthy women can find traumatic, plus the implications of HRT after the fact.

What rights does this girl have???

and the doctors??? agreeing to fight to remove her womb on behalf of a woman who most definately does not come across as balanced imho.....
and yes. I have worked with families in very similar situations. It was never an issue. Periods and special needs. Those families just got on with it.

[Supernick]

Very interesting article beryllium. For what it's worth I'll offer an opinion even though I obviously have no medical qualifications, nor have the experience of caring for a severely disabled relative.

It's stated that it is thought Katie is unable to understand most of what is said to her which to my mind rules out the chance of her ever having children. She can never consent to sex, and could certainly never raise them.

The only question for me is whether invasive surgery is the answer. The fact that some form of chemical sterlization is available that is reversible is irrelevant. She can never consentually utilize her sexual organs. It comes down to the risk of invasive surgery which is always significant. If the same result can be achieved through non-invasive means with no side effects I would always choose that option.

[jodie73]

I have also worked with a lot of young women with M.S a lot of them have an injection every 3 months to stop their periods because it is embarrassing for them to have someone else clean them up. They wouldn't go to this extreme though!

[Beanmistriss]

I'm a support worker and work with people who have learning disabilities. This story makes me very afraid. People are people regardless of disability or not and we all (should) have the same rights as each other. This girl has the right to grow up without being mutilated to make things easier for her mother. Its frightning for everyone when they start their periods and if they don't understand fully whats going on then possibly even more so. That doesn't mean that they can't get used to it the same as everyone else does. It's what happens to everyone as they grow up and this girl has the right to experience this.

Its all very well to say that this woman is trying to do the best for her child. In my experience parents can be blinded to the reality and sense in a situatuion because they are so close to it. Parents with children with disabilities generally find it very difficult to see that person as an adult. Some of the things that I have seen and heard from parents are shocking to say the least, from people not being informed that close relatives are dying to where one family wanted their "child" denied an operation incase that being healthy means that the child will outlive the parents. This story is just horrid.

[daffy654]

If there is an option for her that doesn't require major surgery then she should consider that. I see her point about not putting her daughter on the pill though as the risk of thrombosis to someone who is completely immobile is very high.The last thing the poor girl needs is a stroke.

I know you said you have worked with families in similar situations beryllium but unless you have been sole carer for a severely disabled child then you can't possibly know how hard it is,none of us can.

[Beanmistriss]

It's true to say daffy that you cant know untill you've been in that situation how a parent feels but that doesnt mean that the parent is always right. It doesn't take away the fact that this girl has rights the same as you and me. Yes this girl is never going to be sexually active and have children as she can't consent, but that doesn't mean that her reproductive organs should be removed. My brother in law has no sense of smell due to a brain injury but his parents didnt have his nose removed to save him blowing it when he has a cold.

[Supernick]

If she's that unaware of her surroundings then it seems unlikely that she'll be in the remotest bit aware of menstruation.

From the point of view of the question I'd be interested to know how the excretery process is conducted with Katie, and whether she hasa colostmony bag. It might sound unpleasant, but I wonder if the idea of it being a womb removal makes it an emotive subject. If they took steps to ensure that the excretery process was more comfortable etc, would people care as much? Or does it just come down to the dangers of the procedure?

[beryllium]

The severe CP case I used to care for did not have a colostomy bag. Just nappies :) and a shed load of drugs. Constipation was a slight issue, and of course the usual muscle relaxants because of severe muscle spasms. Her legs were twisted aswell as her spine. She was unable to feed herself, so I would feed her in the evenings and at school for her lunch. I could take her out of her chair and give her lots and lots of cuddles which she loved, and she always had a big big smile when bed time came!!! and stories were read.
Oxygen was always there too for fits and diazepam for the rectum :(

I do feel this would be a horrific operation to put a young girl through.

These particular kids/young adults need to be as happy as is possible at all times. Thank goodness the girls parents I looked after were intelligent enough and balanced enough to know that.

[Le Chat]

I'm quite sure that the girls mother - no mention of a father - is a loving, devoted and caring person. She has to cope with her daughter's disablity every day, all day, 24 hrs and 365 days ...no end to being on duty and probably no life of her own. I think if I were the mother I would be dreading my daughter having periods as it would be yet another scenario which would need her physical involvement ie, lifting, cleaning (yuk!) changing the towel (double yuk), cleaning the blood soaked clothes and linen (it will happen) and administering pain relief when her daughter cries because she has stomach cramps but she doesn't know how or why she has them. I wouldn't spare any tears for the loss of her womb...she isn't going to be using it and wont miss it. On the other hand, the mother wil greatly benefit from not having to do all of the above. I'm sure sometimes she feels she can't cope and the period situation may sadly push her over the edge. My sympathies are with the mother ...100% .

[Lucy Thomas]

In a nutshell, who are we to say whether or not this should be done. We are not the ones who have to give 24 hour care to someone who will never be able to think or do anything for herself.

The decision should be for the parents and no one else.