If the European leaders can't agree on anything.

[nedflanders]

What is the point of their constitution and parliament. plus if UKIP had won every seat in Euro elections what would they do? put themselves out of a job?

[bernardo]

The point of the EU constitution is to create a unitary state presided over by a corrupt wasteful unaccountable dictatorship, and to strangle the nations and peoples of Europe with regulation, interference and oppression. If UKIP had won all the seats, they would have done what their 12 MEPs are now doing (and what the 3 UKIP MEPs have done for the last 5 years) which is to seek information, expose it, and publicise the abominable working practices of the EP and of the EU. The purpose of fighting and winning seats in the EP is to build publicity for the cause and to strengthen UKIP to enable it to win a Westminster General Election in order to liberate the UK from the EU dictatorship.

[Quizmonster]

Michael Howard - whose party took us into Europe and signed the Single European act as well as the Maastricht Traety - recently claimed that only countries have constitutions and that he did not want to belong to a country called 'Europe'. This is, of course, arrant nonsense. Even your local tennis club has a 'constitution'. There are various definitions of the word, of course, but the key one here - as outlined by Chambers Dictionary - is: "a set of rules or guidelines by which an organisation is governed".

Since this particular organisation has just increased considerably in size, it is plain that it must have an agreed set of such rules/guidelines. That's the point. The really amazing thing is how, with goodwill and compromise - though these are often seemingly in short supply! - such agreements can often be reached at all in so diverse a community.

The chances of UKIP ever forming a Westminster government are about on a par with Red Rum's winning another Grand National!

[bernardo]

On the contrary, the UKIP can theoretically win a general election because it will have candidates in most constituencies, whereas Red Rum will not be a candidate in the next Grand National.

[thewillow]

If European leaders can't agree on anything how come they have just agreed a constitution a couple of hours ago? thewillow - europhile.

[Quizmonster]

I did say, B, that the odds re a UKIP win were (quote) 'about' on a par with a Red Rum win and not 'precisely' on par. Being dead, RR's winning chances are infinity to 1 against. The UKIP's I'd set at around "infinity minus 1" to 1 against. That's pretty much 'about on a par' in my view. Cheers...and I'll leave it at that.

[IggyB]

but with the advances in cloning technology and a single hair from the "original" redrum and an evil genius with a secret lab ... think i'll leave it here too

[aimw]

I never understood UKIP - why do they want a job in a parliament they don't want to exist??!! The money?? Noooo!!! As for decision making in the EU - it was always difficult but more so now with 25 member states. However, after all the disagreements in the past, maybe the leaders feel it's about time to show some unity - especially just after enlargement (nice example for the new boys??).

[aimw]

Also, don't you think it's about time for the British people to get some info on Europe - it's no wonder that UKIP won so many seats - people are generally sceptical of the unknown.

[vittoria]

Following this question I searched a legal database which carries full texts of academic articles, looking for information on this EU constitution. Needless to say I got more than I bargained for and I'll be reading for a while. If I ever make sense of it, I'll try and give a sensible reply. In the meantime I just want to say, the Parliament originally only had consultative powers; over time, it carved a role for itself in the law making process of the EU but it is a negative role i.e. they can veto proposals for legislation but cannot make a proposal or amend one. The Constitution could mean two things, the constitution of the EU which is basically the Treaties, being the original one signed in Rome in 1957, as amended by the Maastricht, Amsterdam, Nice, etc., treaties. Or perhaps you mean the EU constitution which is in the news at the moment. This is what I am reading about at the moment to try and get some idea myself.

[vittoria]

Nedflanders, I have read some legal journal articles on the draft constitution (not on the UKIP which I know nothing about)and I have prepared an answer which is not meant to be exhaustive but rather an introduction to a vast subject. The opinions are not my own but a resume of the articles I read. In December 2001 the Heads of the Governments of the Member States established a Constitutional Convention with the task to consider (1) how to bring citizens closer to the European organisation and institutions (2) how to organise the European political area in an enlarged Union, and (3) how the Union can be a stabilising factor and a model in the new world order. To be cont'd.

[vittoria]

Second part. There was perceived to be a need for institutional reform for the Union to function effectively once it admitted ten more members. Further, as the Treaty establishing the European Community (Treaty of Rome, 1957) had been added to and modified by subsequent Treaties (i.e. the Single European Act and the Maastricht, Amsterdam, and Nice Treaties), the resulting consolidated treaty had become difficult to understand for anyone who was not an insider, which does not help if the Union is to be seen as a democratic institution. The Constitutional Convention produced the Draft European Constitution for the Heads of Government of the member states to consider.

[vittoria]

Third and final part. Whilst most of the changes are formal rather than substantive (for example renumbering the Articles, reinforcing the usage of European Union as proposed to the distinction between European Union and European Community) what is good about the proposed Constitution is that certain rights, whilst already part of the corpus of EC law, are being stated as a constitutional right for the first time; for example the right to good administration; the right to be given reasons; the right to compensation for any damage done by the EU or its agents; the right of access to do***ents of the EU or its agents. Another example is that the constitution proposes the relaxation of the rule of standing. This means that a citizen of a member state would in future be able to challenge a EU regulatory act without the need to show individual concern. This reform, if enacted, will improve judicial protection for EU citizens.

[nedflanders]

Thanks for that Vittoria but I can't beleive you used that naughty swear word in your last post ! What were you thinking. I am going to do it. DO***ENTS !!!!! Type it that is !