Will You Be Shopping At Boots This...
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Do you not? Are you not?
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Why are these phrases being used so much these days? Didn't it used to be don't you and aren't you?
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It's the effect of the tv and programmes like Murdoch Mysteries, where old fashioned phrases are used. Aren't you and don't you are quicker and easier than the full phrase. Personally as I am naturally lazy, I shall go on using the shorter versions.
10:14 Tue 22nd Nov 2011
I suspect the plethora of legal programmes on TV to be at least partly responsible. It's common for lawyers to use sentences such as, "You are, are you not, related to the accused?"...or..."It's true to say, is it not, that the business was already in financial difficulties at that time?"...or..."You do, do you not, have a history of taking the law into your own hands?"
Sgt.Rock asks - Didn't it used to be don't you and aren't you?
Not in every dialect of English. People I know in Lancashire use the form "Do you not ... " in everyday speech. This also seems to be a feature of Scottish Standard English http://www.scots-online.org/grammar/sse.htm
Not in every dialect of English. People I know in Lancashire use the form "Do you not ... " in everyday speech. This also seems to be a feature of Scottish Standard English http://www.scots-online.org/grammar/sse.htm
Well, Nox, we HAVE adopted words/phrases from TV over the years. Uni = university was originally Australian and didn't really catch on as a regular usage here in Britain until people in Neighbours, Home and Away etc started saying it frequently on TV. I always try to persuade students I meet nowadays to go back to saying 'varsity'...so much more British and gentlemanly!
Similarly with "Can I get...?" in pubs etc. If you're over 18 and there's a Heineken tap on the bar, OF COURSE you can 'get' a pint of Heineken, so why ask? Why not just say, "A pint of Heineken, please"? In this case, I suspect the American series 'Friends' was responsible, with phrases such as, "Can I get a latte?"
I am not at all against foreign word-imports as such, but only as long as they are in some way more effective or more colourful than what they replace. For instance, '24/7' is much more to the point than 'all day every day'.
Similarly with "Can I get...?" in pubs etc. If you're over 18 and there's a Heineken tap on the bar, OF COURSE you can 'get' a pint of Heineken, so why ask? Why not just say, "A pint of Heineken, please"? In this case, I suspect the American series 'Friends' was responsible, with phrases such as, "Can I get a latte?"
I am not at all against foreign word-imports as such, but only as long as they are in some way more effective or more colourful than what they replace. For instance, '24/7' is much more to the point than 'all day every day'.
-- answer removed --
I don't suppose you are going to like this, Maggoty, but here goes...
‘Can' has been used colloquially to imply a request for permission for over a century and a half, so it is long past time for people to stop saying only ‘may' should be thus employed. "Can I see the manager?" is perfectly acceptable in day-to-day spoken usage.
Only in formal writing - or spoken situations where extreme politeness and formality are called for - is there any need to insist on ‘may'. "Sir, may I have your daughter's hand in marriage?" is the sort of situation in which ‘may' might reasonably be said to be necessary.
Here's what The Oxford English Dictionary says under ‘can' at meaning 6b (quote)..."To be allowed to, to be given permission to = MAY colloquial." (It is first recorded thus in the 1870s.)
And Fowler's Modern English Usage says (quote)..."In informal circumstances, since the second half of the 19th century, can has often been used in contexts of permission where MAY had earlier been obligatory." (So it is no longer obligatory.)
The above two resources are major authorities on British English usage and - clearly - may has not been essential in the informal/colloquial circumstances we are discussing here for well over a hundred years.
Sorry, ma'am!
‘Can' has been used colloquially to imply a request for permission for over a century and a half, so it is long past time for people to stop saying only ‘may' should be thus employed. "Can I see the manager?" is perfectly acceptable in day-to-day spoken usage.
Only in formal writing - or spoken situations where extreme politeness and formality are called for - is there any need to insist on ‘may'. "Sir, may I have your daughter's hand in marriage?" is the sort of situation in which ‘may' might reasonably be said to be necessary.
Here's what The Oxford English Dictionary says under ‘can' at meaning 6b (quote)..."To be allowed to, to be given permission to = MAY colloquial." (It is first recorded thus in the 1870s.)
And Fowler's Modern English Usage says (quote)..."In informal circumstances, since the second half of the 19th century, can has often been used in contexts of permission where MAY had earlier been obligatory." (So it is no longer obligatory.)
The above two resources are major authorities on British English usage and - clearly - may has not been essential in the informal/colloquial circumstances we are discussing here for well over a hundred years.
Sorry, ma'am!
Ande this in response to (h)aitch...
The addition of the letter ‘h' to the front of ‘aitch'...ie the name of the letter itself...is generally regarded as uneducated, though it definitely IS becoming more common in day-to-day usage. In fact, The Oxford English Dictionary - the ‘bible' of English words - does not even list it.
It seems to have originated in Irish English and is relatively common in Australian speech. It may be that - like the rising intonation at sentence ends - Australian soap operas have had some influence. That is possibly because many Irish religious Brothers took teaching positions in the early days of settlement there.
I cannot confirm what follows, but I have been informed that, to this day, one can tell whether someone is an Irish Protestant or a Catholic by asking him to recite the alphabet, The latter, it is claimed, invariably says haitch.
As long ago as the 1700s, the addition or omission of an opening ‘h' was common in British regional speech, giving rise to forms such as the two following...
(a) "If a haitch and a ho and a har and a hess and a he don't spell 'orse, then my name haint 'enry, awkins."
(b) "Rifle butts are made of hoak, hash or ‘ickory." So said the apocryphal army drill-instructor.
So, maybe we can now blame 'Neighbours' for this, TOO!
The addition of the letter ‘h' to the front of ‘aitch'...ie the name of the letter itself...is generally regarded as uneducated, though it definitely IS becoming more common in day-to-day usage. In fact, The Oxford English Dictionary - the ‘bible' of English words - does not even list it.
It seems to have originated in Irish English and is relatively common in Australian speech. It may be that - like the rising intonation at sentence ends - Australian soap operas have had some influence. That is possibly because many Irish religious Brothers took teaching positions in the early days of settlement there.
I cannot confirm what follows, but I have been informed that, to this day, one can tell whether someone is an Irish Protestant or a Catholic by asking him to recite the alphabet, The latter, it is claimed, invariably says haitch.
As long ago as the 1700s, the addition or omission of an opening ‘h' was common in British regional speech, giving rise to forms such as the two following...
(a) "If a haitch and a ho and a har and a hess and a he don't spell 'orse, then my name haint 'enry, awkins."
(b) "Rifle butts are made of hoak, hash or ‘ickory." So said the apocryphal army drill-instructor.
So, maybe we can now blame 'Neighbours' for this, TOO!
Nobody seems to have noticed, or can be bothered to point out, that the original question contained a grammatical howler:
"Didn't it used to be don't you and aren't you?" should be:
Didn't it use to be don't you and aren't you?
In case you have any doubt, compare 'I walked to the shops' with 'I did walk to the shops'
"Didn't it used to be don't you and aren't you?" should be:
Didn't it use to be don't you and aren't you?
In case you have any doubt, compare 'I walked to the shops' with 'I did walk to the shops'
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