Only By Under The Table Means Would This...
Crosswords0 min ago
Listener No 4458: Difficulty By Chalicea
41 Answers
Thanks Chalicea.
Rather simple clues, though, and the theme jumped out a little too obviously.
Rather simple clues, though, and the theme jumped out a little too obviously.
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Yes, Cloverjo and I believe lots of setters watch the thread and are really pleased when solvers are happy with a puzzle. I was quite distressed by Contrarian's instant reaction and most grateful to Midazolam (who is a top setter) for the generous defence of the puzzle, and for all the other appreciative comments. Alekhine, I usually appreciate your comments but this week feel that you are just too clever for your own good - hope your Z cup has something Socratic in it this week and that we get a really tough Mash, Sabre or Quinapalus next week, that keeps you happy and solving until Wednesday.
Ah, a re-appearance of the Sol Campbell argument (this time from laptoplou) ... "anyone who thinks it is 'too easy' might like to try his/her hand at setting a puzzle".
Is that the rule? To criticise, you have to be at least as able or as capable as the target? I think there is a flaw there somewhere, isn't there? I trust no-one here has ever criticised the Prime Minister ... after all, he/she is better at politics than you.
I expect a certain level of challenge from The Listener, and when it falls short ... however clever the puzzle, however enjoyable, however much work went into the setting ... I feel that criticism is merited.
Otherwise why have The Listener? There are plenty of other puzzles out there to fill a gentle hour.
Is that the rule? To criticise, you have to be at least as able or as capable as the target? I think there is a flaw there somewhere, isn't there? I trust no-one here has ever criticised the Prime Minister ... after all, he/she is better at politics than you.
I expect a certain level of challenge from The Listener, and when it falls short ... however clever the puzzle, however enjoyable, however much work went into the setting ... I feel that criticism is merited.
Otherwise why have The Listener? There are plenty of other puzzles out there to fill a gentle hour.
I've been lurking recently having made a recent return to solving, but I can't not comment on this. Yes, it's not the most difficult of solves, but when you consider that the title, preamble and even every single clue are thematic, this has been a tremendous achievement. The PDM here is in realising the extent to which the theme has been followed meticulously in every part of the puzzle. Congratulations to Chalicea on a lovely idea that works perfectly with the much-loved thematic material.
I must say I find it extraordinary that my remarks caused distress. That was certainly not my intention.
Admittedly I ought to have acknowledged the skill that is undoubtedly involved in putting together a puzzle like this - though, when I first completed the puzzle, I didn't realise that the theme had been applied to the entire thing, not just the grid.
However, I stick by my original point. The clues were simple - that's why almost lots of people apparently were able to solve them quickly, and the theme (which is to say, the source itself) did jump out rather obviously (I saw it after about 2 minutes, and someone else here got it from the preamble).
To some extent, I'm probably reacting against a tendency in these threads to err on the side of uncritical sycophancy. I don't see much value in constantly patting setters on the back. Surely if we feel that a puzzle has certain shortcomings, but should be allowed to say so.
Admittedly I ought to have acknowledged the skill that is undoubtedly involved in putting together a puzzle like this - though, when I first completed the puzzle, I didn't realise that the theme had been applied to the entire thing, not just the grid.
However, I stick by my original point. The clues were simple - that's why almost lots of people apparently were able to solve them quickly, and the theme (which is to say, the source itself) did jump out rather obviously (I saw it after about 2 minutes, and someone else here got it from the preamble).
To some extent, I'm probably reacting against a tendency in these threads to err on the side of uncritical sycophancy. I don't see much value in constantly patting setters on the back. Surely if we feel that a puzzle has certain shortcomings, but should be allowed to say so.
septuagenerian - feel free to email me on [email protected].
Some interesting comments above. I absolutely agree with Alekhine that you don't need to be able to set a puzzle in order to critique it, and there is nothing wrong with solvers saying when they found a puzzle too easy; it's all useful feedback.
Still absolutely loved this one, though - I've sent it to several crossword-solving friends who have shied away from the Listener in the past - they are going to love it.
Some interesting comments above. I absolutely agree with Alekhine that you don't need to be able to set a puzzle in order to critique it, and there is nothing wrong with solvers saying when they found a puzzle too easy; it's all useful feedback.
Still absolutely loved this one, though - I've sent it to several crossword-solving friends who have shied away from the Listener in the past - they are going to love it.
Just missing 32dn, which I suspect is because there's something funny going on at the end of that word where it hits the perimeter.
Anyway, this is the first Listener I've had a go at in well over a year, perhaps precisely because it was towards the easier end and I got a little washed out after 2014/15 in which I was aiming for 100% years (or as near as dammit). Probably the last I'll have a go at in a while, too, although I expect once things settle down again I'll be back solving more regularly. Nice to have a puzzle that isn't too demanding to bring me back to the fold, so to speak.
Anyway, this is the first Listener I've had a go at in well over a year, perhaps precisely because it was towards the easier end and I got a little washed out after 2014/15 in which I was aiming for 100% years (or as near as dammit). Probably the last I'll have a go at in a while, too, although I expect once things settle down again I'll be back solving more regularly. Nice to have a puzzle that isn't too demanding to bring me back to the fold, so to speak.
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