Listener 4060 - BAT by Schadenfreude

[turnerjmw]

Quite an entertaining puzzle which may take a little bit of thought at the end.

[AHearer]

Typical Schadenfreude: precise but sometimes quite hard clueing, tricky but reasonable mid-game with the title providing confirmation, and the usual "how on earth does he do it?" final step. Having two of Schadenfreude's offerings (see other entries on this site under CAM or Crossword 2) this week was an unexpected pleasure.

[midazolam]

yes took a look of thought at the end. A very enjoyable puzzle by Schadenfreude, who seems to have a crossword published every few weeks (16 crosswords this year alone in listener, inquisitor, magpie and using oxymoron in the EV, not counting CAM etc)

One of my top crosswords this year and what i feel the listener is all about. Thanks

[zita-green]

I know I'm going to have a 'doh' moment but have you really finished already?

[Ruthrobin]

Don't worry, Zita, we are not half way through solving the clues yet - though the light is beginning to dawn.

[jamesah]

Brilliant puzzle and more accessible than I thought when I read the preamble. I agree- how does he do it?

[midazolam]

...and they keep on coming. Schadenfreude is the compiler of today's inquisitor in the independent. copy available by email [email protected]

that damn times website!

[cluelessJoe]

It has all been said above .. another stunning offering from a master, and a great way to waste a wet and windy couple of hours.

[Ruthrobin]

Clueless Joe, I have just reached the enb and it has taken me more like ten hours! I have to agree with all that has been said. How does he do it?

[bobbycollins]

Spot on ladies and gents - a super offering.

Exactly the right level for an ageing brain, pushed me all the way without asking the impossible of my old cerebellum.

Don't see the wordplay to 21a though.

I guess I'll have to do the Times Saturday with the England game, although friendlies are pretty grim at the best of times, and the heat won't help.

[midazolam]

thank goodness the times has corrected its huge blunder by putting the solution on their website this morning (in case anyone was wondering the relevance of my last comment)

[Ruthrobin]

Midazolam, do you mean the answer to this one appeared?
Bobby Collins - think of a synonym for the definition word - put that round a one letter abbreviation and two letters that you take from the centre in question - and you get a lovely clue that justifies the question mark. I am sure that was acceptably obscure to avoid having slapped fingers (?)

[midazolam]

yes robinruth, I cringed when i went to the site early this morning. I hope there were not many who noticed, but another crossword site made it quite obvious the solution was there, and i thought they were not meant to mention current puzzles!

[bobbycollins]

Thanks, Ruthrobin

Easy when you know how it works. I had missed that obvious abbreviation. Good clue indeed.

[Clamzy]

I do sometimes make life difficult. Having skimmed the preamble, taking in only the first sentence, I cold solved all except the last clue. At that stage it dawned that the path I was on was impossible. Doh.
Anyway a most enjoyable puzzle - thanks Schadefreude.

[Ruthrobin]

Yes, Clamzy, I went down just the same blind alley for ages until a couple of intersecting clues made me realize that it was far easier than I had suspected.

[tristram37]

I'm new to contributing to this website though have followed it with interest for some time. I'm totally baffled by this puzzle. I've solved all the clues but cannot see how one can resolve a code when there are no letters in clear with which to compare the coded ones. Any hint would be more than welcome.

[Ruthrobin]

Dear Tristram 37. Consider the preamble very carefully. 'The rows numbered 1 and 42 contain a three word phrase which at first appears encoded. Solvers must decode the phrase into the grid to be submitted, thus creating new (real) down words.' You are being told that you have to put 20 different (real) down words into the grid. That should help.

[bobbycollins]

....so it follows that the checked letters of the top and bottom rows must be altered to give new (real) words. The fact that several of those letters are the same got me going on cracking the code. No slapped wirists here too - hopefully.

[starwalker]

Nothing really to add to what has been said already. A typical Listener with no dodgy clues or complicated preamble and a final step that was difficult without ever seeming to be out of reach. The only thing that I found remarkable was Schadenfreude's ability to produce so many puzzles of such a consistently high standard.

[tristram37]

Thank you, Ruthrobin. I was barking totally up the wrong tree since I'd read the preamble to indicate that the entire grid had to be encoded. Now that would be a tour de force!