Science delusion?

[Khandro]

Despite millions (billions?) of pounds spent on funding prestigious institutions and mega-projects, ask what these scientific 'breakthroughs' add up to and clear answers seem elusive.
By the time science has (it hopes) solved the big questions of the origin of the Universe and how the galaxies and our Earth were formed, could what comes after be an anticlimax, and of no relevance whatsoever to the condition of humanity?

[Canary42]

It's a possibility, yes.

[Slapshot]

It's important because every big discovery leads to the smaller discoveries and inventions that change our lives, if we don't invest in science we'd be as well burying our heads in the sand....how we adapt in the future is critical science will help us there

[jake-the-peg]

It often takes a while for fundamental research to filter into technology.

In the early years of the 20th century fundamental research focussed on Quantum Mechanics - quantum weirdness.

50 years or so later this information gave us lasers, micro-electronics, superconductor used in MRI scanners, understanding of antimatter used in PET scanners etc. etc.

Earlier still Faraday's messing around with electricity scared a lot of people and seemed of little use.

But even if it wasn't to provide technological gains, fundamental research, the search for real concrete knowledge is one of the greatest of human endeavours and is a worthy persuit in its own right, easilly the equal of great works of art.

Large experiments like CERN (to which I think you allude ) are very expensive but they are contributed to by many nations in a spirit of co-operation which the great religions can only dream of.

I have yet to see Physicists and Biologists shoot at each other (close some times)

[d9f1c7]

Most of the stuff in your house would not exist if we never did any reasearch that you and your unimaginative cohorts had there way. I'd rather pay for 10 LHC's than all the work shy layabouts we fund.

I've looked at some of your past posts and I can see you have bee in your bonnet about this. Why is that?

[Old_Geezer]

Knowledge is its own reward. Why does it need to have a use in day to day life ?

Besides everything where science is been applied to "improve" our lives had to start at some point purely as curiosity being satisfied. I'm unsure why you think the answer is elusive, for the most part it covers every advance we have.

[grasscarp]

What if the hokey cokey is what it is all about?

[Old_Geezer]

Then we'd be right in it !

[Khandro]

Jake, please help me here I'm struggling, are you seriously suggesting that Faraday's "messing around with electricity" is any way compatible with the gigantic investment in fanciful experimentation such as CERN which if it proves anything, which I doubt, can be of no value to the real issues facing our planet, do you want me to list these ?

d9, Calm down dear! and answer the question, as Jake at least attempted to do.

[d9f1c7]

electricity was originally dismissed as nothing more than a curosity initially, learned minds of the time, basing their utterings on DC, they said it would never replace gas lights. All I'm saying is that many things when initially discovered had no use or thier use could never have been imagined. Who can say what future benefits c

[d9f1c7]

....come from understanding. The first CRT screen is a direct result of early atom smashing. I assume you hve watched TV or used a CRT computer screen?

[Zacs-Master]

Well, you won't find out whether it's an anti climax in your lifetime. So chill and enjoy the ride on this, possibly the most beautiful,spaceship in the universe.

[grasscarp]

I am old enough to remember gas lights in my grandfathers flat and watching them being lighted. A lot has gone on in a short time. I remember cars with opening windscreens, sitting in dicky seat, steam trains and trolley buses in London.

[naomi24]

//could what comes after be an anticlimax, and of no relevance whatsoever to the condition of humanity? //

It could be, but that doesn't mean it will be. Expectation of potential is often hindered by the limitations of current experience.

[Graham-W]

A solution to easy fusion would give us virtually free electricity. Perhaps that's why it's taking so long.
Life, the universe and everything? That's easy! 42!

[jomifl]

In terms of bangs for bucks scientific research has paid back far more than religion and philosophy. If you have an alternative please tell.

[Khandro]

"I'm astounded by people who want to 'know' the universe, when it's hard enough to find your way around Chinatown" - Woody Allen.

A couple of years ago at dinner in Oxford, I sat next to a physicist who told me he believed; "The greatest threat to our planet was from that of the impact of a giant asteroid". Further research led me to discover that he was 'eminent' in this 'field', having received several grants and had published many papers and was the author of books on the subject, in fact you could say he had made a career out of this issue, kept by the state purse with a substantial pension to look forward to. However, the Astronomer Royal; Martin Rees in a recent interview asserts, "Some cranks claim that we we won't even survive 2012 because a giant asteroid will destroy the Earth - complete nonsense! the things like asteroids are quantifiable but very low risks. Those risks are no higher now than they were for the Neanderthals.' Who is deluded?

[naomi24]

I'm not sure what you're suggesting here, Khandro. Do you think all such research should stop?

[FredPuli43]

Khandro, what wiped out the dinosaurs? Be nice to know what asteroids are doing. Do you think your physicist was doing something else as well, teaching for example, or involved in research, the most interesting bit of which to the layman at a dinner, would be the asteroid collision bit?

Fact is, that nearly all scientific research looks boring to outsiders, and most of it has no obvious and interesting benefit to us. Seems to me, as an outsider, the biggest problem scientists have is in getting funding for the research they want to do. They have to make it sound attractive and useful. Faraday's answer that some day you may be able to tax it [electricity], wouldn't have got him far in itself.

[jake-the-peg]

I'm suggesting that it was fundamental research who's application was uninvisioned at the time.

the story goes that when shown the little piece of wire spinning on a pool of mercury the Prime Minister said "very good but what use is it"

Faraday replied "I don't know sir but one day you may tax it!"

Costs of "big science" research have become very high since then but even in the 18th Century Scientists often needed wealthy patrons.

Think on this though - if we don't fund research it will be left to big corporations like IBM - they will then own the intellectual propert and patents

The only form of cold fusion that might be found to work is that catalysed by subatomic particles like muons.

If someone were able to get that to work would you want it in the public domain or would you like the patent to be held privately?

[jomifl]

Khandro, how do you imagine Martin Rees acquired the stats. to make his statement re. asteroid strike risk. I imagine your asteroid expert had a teaching post at the university. Since his research applies to the whole world it sounds like good value to me. We need people to enquire into what seems improbable or even faintly ridiculous, that is how knowledge is gained.