Vegetarian vs. Non-vegetarian

[Pelly8910]

Why is it healthier to eat quorn or something like that rather than real meat?

[chakka35]

joko, I am not putting words into your mouth, merely asking questions. That's what AB is for. You seem to be taking offence where none is offered.

And like jomifl I would still like to know what your overall point is. That is a question, please note, not an attack.

[joko]

i have said all i can really, numerous times, i have addressed all the points raised in previous posts....i am amazed you keep asking...i am speaking plain english and i dont know how many other ways to say it...

i am not suggetsing anyone believe anything just because i say so...rather the exact opposite - go and look for yourselves...but also look without some preconceived and ingrained notion....read the facts and figures, check details, read research, address the logic, etc and just see for yourself...steer clear of sites that staunchly support one side or the other, and simply look at the neutral more scientific ones...going on and on at me as though i am some idiot who believes the earth is flat changes nothing

i am really not sure why so many are so deeply opposed to this ... it does not make us any less of a redblooded, superior species

[chakka35]

You haven't addressed everything asked - for example, the question I raised (for the second time) in my last. Neither have you told us what the point is that you are trying to make.

Never mind, you seem to be easily upset by straight questions, interpreting them as attacks. So perhaps we should all shut up and give you a break.

[joko]

chakka, i am not upset at all... why would i be?
i just cant be bothered saying the same thing over and over again...its getting us nowhere...
the fact that i have had to say the same things over an over - and also 'defend' myself to people who appear to be largely agreeing with men roundabout ways implies that people just want to have a pop at me... i

the fact that despite me having said over and over agian what my point is and what the whole nature of this issue is, you an others are still asking me what it si, simply baffles me...i cannot think of any other formulations of the english language in which to make sentences to say what is actually a very simple premise...

i feel like i have been dealing with a child who, no matter what you say just asks why again

see other posts for the answers... i know its a long thread but if you look its all there...

[joko]

that is not to say you are like a child or being childish, just that the questioning was frustrating to respond to in that way

[chakka35]

I'll have one more try...

By 'point' I mean a meaningful conclusion from the facts you have given us regarding teeth, claws etc. Repeating myself, If I were to point out that we can fly and exist under water, not because we have the natural ability to but because we have brains to help us, you could reasonable ask "So? What point are you making?".

You haven't told us, which is why we keep having to ask (which I can assure you is just as tedious for us as it is for you).

And you still haven't justified one of yor "facts": that man was naturally a herbivore while nevertheless having a digestive system suitable for meat.

[joko]

chakka... i too will have one more try -
my point is simply that!
thats all i said -
it was just a comment...that has not been allowed to be just that...i am demanded to explain it over and over again...

that we are not physically well suited to being a predator/ carnivore, because physically we dont have the necessary attributes - that all other carnivores have - and we needed to create weapons an tools in order to do the job - without those things we couldnt do it...a simple point, made numerous times...

i noted the issue of flying and swimming myself in an earlier post - and again it has been said back to me, as though opposing me, - but is actually confirming my point - we do these things because we can, and we have the brains to make it happen - not because our bodies are naturally designed too - no other animal invents things on the scale we do, because they havent the brains to... that its, thats all i was saying...and everyone got upset becaue they didnt like to think that i might be right...
it seems many people instinctively and kneejerkingly just dont like the idea that we are not ultimate hunting machines etc...and because they feel the need to argue against a veggie...because some seem to feel i am on a crusade so have to oppose at all costs...i am not at all !!
at no point have i said meat is bad for us, stop eating it, or talked about the poor animals etc etc - my comment have been purely based on physiology and biology...shee
so why there is this continual 'kneejerk 'arguing the toss' i dont know...

regarding the digestive systems...most mammals, if given meat will be able to digest it...sheep will eat it, chickens eat it...among others...they may not particularly like it, but it wont kill them or do them any real harm...so its irrelevant to state the fact that we too can manage meat without any harm...but neither could suddenly become predators...because they havent the at

[chakka35]

joko, why not just answer the points you are asked about without all this extra stuff about how badly you are misunderstood, how exasperated you are getting, with absurdities about knee-jerking and so on? We are not so stupid on AB as to keep asking the same question if we can see that it has been answered.

Anyway, I'll leave now. Over to the rest of you folks, if you can stand the constant complaining and self-justification..

[joko]

well you clearly are or you wouldnt keep asking!

i have already explained my point!
in detail!...
numerous times...
its a very simple concept and i dont know any other way of saying it.

i have come to those conclusions because i am speaking plain english, have copied info in for ease of understanding yet still you just ask why why why...not sure why you are having such a problem reading them, and choosing to badger me instead of just reading back over the posts...or looking it up...

enough now...you are just being deliberately obtuse... and frankly tedious.

[joko]

if for some reason you want to know WHY i even mentioned this subject at all...quite simply - i felt like it...i find it a very interesting notion, and it relates to the subject of the OPs question, and perhaps links to why quorn etc is often considered healthier than meat...so i commented...which i believe is the point of ab...i do not need any other reason to raise these points...

[jomifl]

Hi Chakka... I've almost lost the will to live..If you can manage to keep going you have my deepest respect. :-)

[joko]

lost the argument you mean...or rather you didnt really have one to begin with did you?

you have still not said anything truly to the contrary regarding this, or that truly rebuffs the points made...

[society]

"that we are not physically well suited to being a predator/ carnivore, because physically we dont have the necessary attributes - that all other carnivores have - and we needed to create weapons an tools in order to do the job - without those things we couldnt do it...a simple point, made numerous times... "

I believe we are the more advanced species of the animal kingdom and are are able to utilise our brain and think and become creative. Just look at the long, long, long way man have come...

[starone]

And to put the cat among the pigeons so to speak, I reckon we were probably cannibals as well, as there would be no point in letting any meat go to waste would there?

[joko]

society - thank you - that is exactly the crux of what i have been saying!!!
that it is our superior brains that makes us omnivores not our natural physical make up! without those brains we would probably only eat meat through scavenging...

read back through the posts and you will see!

starbuck one...very probably - even humans now would eat another human if it stopped them starving - me inlcuded...there have been many documented cases...

[jomifl]

Really Joko.. Just explain to me what argument you believe that I have lost and I will gladly rejoin the debate. Meanwhile I am off to have fried liver and fava beans washed down by a nice little Chianti.

[pa___ul3]

joko, even if we only ate meat through scavenging, we'd still be omnivores!

[joko]

lol jomilf...well none really, because you didnt really say much to the contrary... you just tried to imply that you were exasperated with my comments - which is unimportant ... but you and others have continually dismissed what i have said...yet appeared not to have actually read it...and also implied i am some sort of fanatic on a quest... but you really havent really successfully been able to rebuff any of it...

theres no need to rejoin the debate - its over with...its pointless.
i am entitled to comment in whatver way i like on here and you are free to agree or disagree... it really doenst matter to me, nor does it change anything

[joko]

err...yes...i know pa__ul... we would... the word omnivore just means we eat both...so we are undoubtedly omnivores - i havent said otherwise...so not sure why you are saying that as though i have...?

you see what i mean? no idea why you have even said that

pointless

[erin-x]

This is still going on from Monday.... jeeso! lol