wind power

[Hugh Spencer]

One of the greatest scams of our age.
Wind turbines ludicrously inefficient.
Save less than one jumbo jet flying to USA every day.
Heavy price we are paying over the past two decades.
The government want us to spend £100 billion to build 10,000 more turbines plus £40 billion to connect to the grid.

[R1Geezer]

....and your question is?

[rov1100]

I quite agree about wind power.

Why have not considered in more detail about heat energy below the Earths surface where there is a project to dig a shaft 2km down. This is currently happening near Newcastle. No polution, no eyesores, no mess, just abundent regular energy to heat a whole town?

[rov1100]

Link to the above:

http://www.guardian.c.../23/geothermal-energy

[Hugh Spencer]

Yes, Mark. What do contributors think about the huge waste of money taking place to continue the inefficient development of wind farms? The Danes have built more wind farms per head than anyone and realised what a waste of money it has been. In Spain it has been a disaster. The Dutch have slashed all their renewables subsidies.

[jomifl]

When oil has become unaffordable and battery powered cars have become more efficient we will all want a wind powered generator. If we can afford the tax the government will slap on them.

[beso]

Wind turbines ludicrously inefficient?

Rubbish. They are the cheapest sustainable way to make electricity.

Your figures are also highly suspect. What size wind turbine in what location? Please provide references rather than unsubstantiated numbers. Anyway, if each one offset a 747 flight it sounds well worthwhile.

Besides, maybe we should be looking seriously at the sustainability of so much air travel.

[Hugh Spencer]

Wind farms' output average about a quarter of their capacity. The 1000 megawatts from 3,500 turbines is no more than the output from a single medium sized conventional power station. The Swedish firm which recently opened the world's largest offshore windfarm costing £800 million, designed to produce 300 megawatts for tens of thousands of homes, on average produces 80 megawatts.

[Hugh Spencer]

If anyone can provide vastly different statistics to those I have stated, provided they don't come from the government or its allied scientists, please publish them. I received my information from an independent source but , at the moment, I am not prepared to reveal it.

[Hugh Spencer]

I have decided that more people should be able to read more than what I have written already so - Google Christopher Booker, scroll down to £250 billion wind power industry could be the greatest scam of our age, MailOnline, read and also read the comments from others.

[McMouse]

My great granddad had a windmill in his village and it provided power for milling wheat to provide bread for the entire community. Don't know how efficient it was but clearly they didn't starve.

[Old_Geezer]

Yeah but all it had to do was turn a grindstone for a bit.

[Khandro]

I have tried for sometime, without success, to find out the cost, in both terms of energy and finance, exactly what it takes to make, install, and maintain a wind turbine, and then how long (if ever, before it needs replacing) is needed until these costs can be offset by the 'free' energy it produces. I ask again, does anybody know?

[jomifl]

Hi khandro, I did a bit of work in connection with wind turbines so I can give you the following facts
A 1.5 megawatt wind turbine at 30% load factor would generate about £2 million of electricity at 5 pence per unit of electricity (kilowatt hour) per year. With a design life of 20 years it would earn £40 million. The recent cost of the above turbine was £1.5 million. so even with installation costs and maintainance it would be a good earner and not a scam. Best not to believe what you read in the papers.

[DTCwordfan]

beso - they are not the cheapest way to make electricity - that actually goes to a Diesel engine and, de facto, really sharpens the economics for all concerned in the energy debate when it comes to renewables. Only the biggest towers are the most economic, especially when total life cycle analysis is applied. These micro-turbines are actually disasterous on a TLC basis - true we feel good when we see our own meters backing up on themselves......

The future may be a myriad of solutions dependent on local geography and conditions - for example geothermal may be very attractive for some such as down here in Cornwall.....tidal and waves too, once they prove themselves and some aspects of solar are now getting close to Nat Gas generation combso of investment and operation charges per MWh

[Khandro]

Jomifl, Your figures are impressive; outlay of £1.5 million returning £38.5 million. I would have thought investors would be murdering one another to get a share of that! OK, supposing this was a fact, you say the financial cost of installing one is 1.5 million, how many watts of energy have been required to achieve that? What I mean is, we know that riding a bicycle is a 'free' form of transportation, but the cost - in terms of obtaining the materials, and manufacturing the bike and thereby depleting the earth's resources must be calculable. There is no free lunch, and the bottom line is not simply a financial one. Smothering the planet with wind farms would not give us free energy would it?

[Buenchico]

How about aesthetics?

The stunning beauty of wind farms alone is reason enough for their existence, in my opinion:
http://www.folkdisco....ach%20wind%20farm.jpg

[237SJ]

There is no stunning beauty in windfarms when they blight the beautiful landscape in some areas (my old village). Not to mention the din they make. Yes, there is stunning beauty in them when they are not in your back yard.

[scotman]

One thing about the slender elegant beauty of wind turbines - it doesn't take much jelly to knock them over.

[regulo]

They may be very good for us when the wind blows, but what do we do when it doesn't? During spells of cold weather in winter, we are usually under a high pressure system, which often means no wind, thus no wind power, thus we need some other means of generation . . .or we have to depend on importing it.

[Khandro]

As things stand, I'm afraid nuclear is the only realistic game in town.