allahu akbar

[To-Ryscum]

Is it not true,that The Qu"ran,the Torah and The Old Testament are
fundamentally the same book ?

So why the enmity between the religions,why does one claim superior
knowledge over another ?

Surely Jewish people have more right to feel aggrieved at this blatant
plagiarism?

As to Allah,Jah,God..et al..what"s in a name?
Surely,just a case of "lost in translation"!

[Ankou]

i would most certainly feel that 1 volt then.

i guess that is end of my sermon. good night.

[daisya]

And I'm off for tea too. Well done, good debate.

[keyplus90]

Thanks to all of you. Time to pack up here too.

[KARL]

Just a friendly hello for keyplus: Comparing with your contributions of many months ago, your debating skills are much improved and I like your more balanced approach (genuine tolerance is showing). However, they remain firmly rooted in the subjective firmament of your chosen reference scripture which is likely to hold you back (in my opinion). So long as you are chained to a set of rules which box you in, you can always be cornered because your responses are so predictable. Please don't misunderstand me, you are perfectly entitled to accept and adopt as the truth any explanation of life and the universe that you choose, but what you may yet come round to accepting is that others are entitled to the explanations they choose for themselves (including and in particular the conclusion that it is all unknown - entirely unknown) and we should not make any attempt at converting them to ours (contrary to the classic religious posture). We simply do not know the answers to any of this (note: "Read verse X" is not proof of anything other than that someone chose to record such a statement and attribute it to the almighty). Some choose to guess (either way, yay or nay) and others choose to refuse all the guessing and wait for evidence/proof that they will find convincing. The last group are the ones who are entirely unconvinced by any and all of the traditional explanations (religions, atheism and everything at either end of the spectrum), they place themselves on neutral ground in the middle and sit on the question mark (what some refer to as the fence, which is another way of insisting one choose between "us" and "them" - a curious form of tribalism).

[sith123]

i am a muslim and yes, we believe that they were all sent to prophets and all told the truth, but over time were changed and distorted, muslims now only follow the quran as we believe it is the only one not to have been changed and remain truthful...so yes, they do fundamentally teach the same. as for your question about the hostility between religions, i am not so sure, but i do know that muslims and jews have had a long negative history between the two...i am no expert on islam so if everyone is, i am willing to learn more as well...hope this helps mate.

[sith123]

oh wait, the conversation is finished dammit...i was to late

[Truthabounds]

What I would like to know is how a question about the quran, torah and old testment brought in a subject such as electricity? Please enlighten me (ha ha)

[Truthabounds]

The principal teaching of Islam, for utter simplicity, is what is known as the shahadah, or confession of faith, which every Muslim knows by heart: “La ilah illa Allah; Muḥammad rasul Allah” (No god but Allah; Muḥammad is the messenger of Allah). This agrees with the Quran expression, “Your God is One God; there is no God save Him, the Beneficent, the Merciful.” This was stated 2,000 years earlier with the ancient call to Israel: “Listen, O Israel: Jehovah our God is one Jehovah.” (Deuteronomy 6:4) Jesus repeated this command, at Mark 12:29, about 600 years before Muḥammad, and nowhere did Jesus claim to be God or to be equal to Him.

[LazyGun]

@Keyplus - In some respects, the insistence of some of the more fervent believers in Islam to insist that their magic book, the Koran, is a repository of scientific wisdom that modern science is only just coming to terms with is more wearying that those of the christian faith who just refute the science completely.

Many of these optimists make claims like "scientists were shocked and speechless when they are shown how detailed and accurate some verses in the Koran are to modern science". Such over the top presentations are just begging to be factually refuted, and many actual, proper, credentialled scientists have spent a lot of time doing just that.

The Koran is riddled with scientific and rational inconsistencies that do not bear up under any scientific scrutiny, and those who claim otherwise are just both making fools of themselves, and appearing foolish to those who have to read this rubbish.Makes you wonder why they are so keen to clothe themselves in the labcoat of respectability that science offers when they are mostly so anti-science themselves, doesn't it?

This is why you get frankly illiterate commentary to the effect that just because we cannot see something with the unaided sight, or touch something, this is somehow proof that supernatural forces exist, totally and utterly ignoring the fact that humanity is a clever mammal and one that has used science and rational thinking and logic and applications of all of those things to augment our senses, to create all the wonders of the modern world and better understand the Universe we are part of.

Scientific illiteracy and a willingness to believe supernatural garbage in the absence of evidence is a continuing, toxic blight on humanities development Some can, with some effort and application, crawl out of the pit of burning stupid they have created for themselves, but for most it is just easier and more comfortable to wallow in the mud of their own preconceptions.

Sadly, the rest of us have to put up with the worst excesses that such irritationality brings - the schisms, the religious wars, and the rest. Hundreds, if not thousands of years of human development later, and we still have people with extreme religious views commiting atrocities in an effort to force the rest of us to either turn away and just ignore some of their worst cultural excesses, or worse, force us to submit to their madness.

[keyplus90]

///Such over the top presentations are just begging to be factually refuted, and many actual, proper, credentialled scientists have spent a lot of time doing just that.///

Would you care about enlightning us with few of those credentialled scientists please.

[LazyGun]

@Keyplus - Thats not how it works Keyplus - You can, I am sure, use Google as well as the rest of us - it is not my job to spoonfeed you. References aplenty from affilitiation sites like answering islam or internet infidels showing why the scientific claims of these verses is either just plain wrong or borrowed piecemeal from elsewhere.

Of Particular interest are the various medical claims, often claimed as orginal, but actually recycled Hippocrates or Galen from years before.
Trying to re-interpret verses in an attempt to fit modern cosmology or medicine just makes those "academics" who try look very silly.

[keyplus90]

Of course you do not have to spoon feed me. And of course I can google. But the only difference is that I do read answering Christianity too once I have read answering Islam. As for what you said about Galen and others, we have talked more than once here and there are people who have sound reputation in the field but they do not say that what Quran said is same as what Galen said. Perhaps they managed to compare two but you just did not bother. Perhaps that is the reason you are a pixel on a website and they are real people. However If you are interested then I don’t mind spoon feeding you. I can give you information about what Galen said as well as what Indians, Arabs and Persians believed before Quran was revealed and then of course I would give you information about what Quran said on the same topic. In the end all you have to do is compare them and see. But I have my doubts that you would do that. After all you are not lazy for no reason.

[keyplus90]

And yes, if you are interested then post another link as this question is not about that and I do not like hijacking threads.