morality

[wizard69]

Do we NEED holy books to teach us morality, or is it inbuilt ? If you need the Quran or the Bible to tell you what is right or wrong, is there not something wrong with your morals....ie...you would kill, steal, rape, etc because you would have no book to tell you that it was right or wrong?

[lafrancaise]

It's our parents and elders (teachers amongst others) who teach us right from wrong. They in turn learnt from their elders but the beginning of these morals may have been learnt from ancestors through religion, so I'd say we do probably need holy books to teach morality. As for morality being inbuilt, I don't think so - we learn respect towards our neighbours etc to damper jealousy, lust etc

[noxlumos]

No of course you don't need a book, holy or otherwise to have morals of a high standard, although most religious people would tell you you do by definition.

[luna-tic]

There have been numerous cases where certain clergy have been found guilty of paedophilia so I suppose their reading of the Bible didn't help but they may of had these tendencies before becoming a member of the church so either way the so-called "Good Book" didn't exactly put them on the right path.
I suppose it would be different if a known paedophile,rapist,murderer or whatever who had never had any inclination toward religion or reading the Bible suddenly decided to and it completely changed their behaviour.
The other point is:What about terrorists? These claim they are either killing themselves and innocent people for a cause yet are devout in their religious practices.Although I do think in some instances their motives are irrational and twisted.Maybe the book their reading from has been tampered with.

[Theland]

Speaking from my own personal experience, I have always felt an inbuilt morality that generally defined right from wrong.

I say generally as at one time I would feel it right to take revenge, get even etc, whereas now I believe that is wrong.

[mikeyp]

In the case of terrorists I'm fairly sure they've misinterpreted the book if they're using one to obtain their morals.

No we do not need books to learn about morality, although it is not inbuilt. You have to learn it from somewhere, so if it was a case of learn from the bible or not learn at all - as wizard69 asked - then yes you would not have any morals if you don't read the book. But this is a large over-simplification, as lafrancaise said, it's the people who bring us up that have the most effect on our morals.

[ummmm]

No you don't need a book. I believe for some they need good guidance and for others they need lot's of guidance.

[Theland]

The koran teaches a perverse morality

[wizard69]

Theland...the koran is no more (and no less) perverse than the bible.

[Theland]

The essence of the Bible, is, "Love God. Love Neighbour." Anybody detracting from this is using their own or somebody elses authority.

The koran on the other hand, teaches submission to Allah, by conversion, with the sword if necessary.

The 9/11 and 7/7 bombers didn't twist the teaching, they took the Jihad to the infidel, us, just as is taught.

Please consider the thoughts of this Lebanese lady, Brigitte Gabriel, who can speak on this with greater clarity.

http://www.americancongressfortruth.com/

[LazyGun]

Theland, a conservative christian with an agenda is hardly an impartial dispenser of the truth, is she?

As for your assertion that the essence of the bible is love God, love neighbour... I will grant you the first part, but dispute the second.
It all comes down to interpretation and to which part of the bible you are referring to. The God of the OT was a jealous, vindictive, nasty piece of work, and I pity the neighbouring tribes of the jews who bore the brunt of their bloodthirsty beliefs.

Koran and Bible both can equally be used to perform acts of violence against the unbeliever.

Your post, in essence, is pot...kettle.... black.

[wizard69]

Theland....many, many times in the bible god orders the extermination of entire cities...men, women, children and animals.Please reconcile this with "love" for me please

[dawkins]

You don't seem to have a lot of love for Muslims Theland. I'm still to fully understand this moral authority that enables you to confidently write off more than a billion people based on a book. I'm sure if you actually understood the religion you are so keen to defend that you would keep your own council on the morality of others but I suspect that your prejudice gets the better of you.