Anyone trully believe in life after death??

[taliesin238]

Can anybody out there %100 put their hand on their heart and say that they beleive that the dead are still around looking over our shoulder??? Maybe you have seen a ghost, or been told something by a suppose spiritualist?? I have many different thoughts and beleifs but i can say about 96% that i believe in life after death!!

[Campfire]

chakka35 - absolutely correct, well said.

Look how many "believers" who have posted here talk of how they "like" to believe in something, or "need" to believe in something. I mean I'm just speechless... I didn't know lying to yourself was so desirable, when in your heart of hearts you MUST know it's crap? And you just.. persist? It's so bizarre to me. Get a grip people.

[gina32]

how can some things be explained?

[China Doll]

Lots of it is psychological.

[jake-the-peg]

Just because you can't explain something doesn't mean you need to believe in the supernatural.

The vikings probably asked "how else do you explain lightning?" It didn't mean Thor suddenly faded away as soon as we understood.

150 years ago nobody understood why the sun shone but nobody thought it was Apollo!

[tubeway]

I dont feel the need to believe in anything, I believe that there is a life force - otherewise what is the difference between a living person and a fresh corpse. The corpse may have the same chemical composition as the living person, everything may be capable of working - but there is still a difference.
It is easy to dismiss something because you do not understand it. There is much still to be explained and in the future people may wonder what the problem was with people not understanding.
I have had some unexplainable experiences - and have never been the sort of person to go and look for them. In fact I generally keep them quiet as I feel uncomfortable about some of the things that have happened and feel that some people may not beleive - so dont bother to tell my experiences. I feel that many people feel this way about psychic experiences.

[naomi24]

Jake, I believe the 'soul' is still there in people who sustain brain damage, even if their personalities change. You could say the same of people suffering from dementia. Physically their bodies no longer work as they should, but I believe the soul remains untouched.

Waldo, I am not afraid of death itself - but I am afraid of experiencing pain, suffering, and lengthy incarceration in an NHS hospital on the way there!

Theland, where have you been - apart from on another website? So pleased you're ok and back with us. There are lots of answers to all the questions you posted a week or so back - and all awaiting a response - so come on - do please get to it!!

Chakka, how we can say that anything is nonsense unless we have proof that it is? We can only utilise our own experience to decide whether we believe it or not.
(PS - and apologies to taliesin238 for going off track. How's the quiz going? I'm really struggling on the last few now. Can't see me getting 100% this time).

Tubeway, I feel pretty much the same way.

[jake-the-peg]

Then perhaps naomi you should explain to us why you believe that and what you believe the soul actually is then.

Most people seem to relate the concept of a soul to a uniquely individual part of what makes them who they are and someone's personality is pretty much that too.

On a slightly different note souls obviously would have to come into being - to be created.

When something is created it happens when one or more unique elements come together.

Reversing the process is destruction.

If something can be created it can be destroyed

[Jeth]

I too agree with Kyra - I wish I did but I can't (not don't, if that makes sense).
Perhaps the way we live on is just in how our lives impinge on others during our lifetime and hence afterwards......

By the way, I really enjoy reading the opinions posted in this section of AB, it opens my mind to lots of ideas which are totally new to me and I previously had no knowledge of.

[chakka35]

naomi, I can't believe that you yourself refuse to dismiss things as nonsense unless you can prove them to be so. Otherwise you would believe in Santa Claus, fairies, magic carpets and unicorns. I' m sure you could compile a list of nonsense-to-you things without thinking twice about it. So can I, and life after death is one of them.
Being a rational fellow (and, as you know, a sceptic) I would think differently if tomorrow somebody were to produce some tiny smidgeon of evidence of an afterlife. All we have at the moment is some vague idea of a 'soul' invented by religionists and the crooked activities of 'spiritualists'.
I can't prove that elves don't exist but I don't intend to leave my shoes out tonight in the hope that they'll be magically repaired.
(About 75 in the quiz but neglecting it for the moment because of other things. You'll get your 100, I expect. Plenty of time yet.)

[naomi24]

Jake, I've said many times on R&S that certain experiences in my life lead me to my belief. I wish I could reach a different conclusion, but I simply cannot explain them and therefore have no alternative but to believe in the survival of the soul.

I don't believe the soul is purely one's personality. Emotions and the feelings that emotions produce are also part of a person's inner being, and the soul encompasses all. Whether or not a soul is created, and therefore is capable of being destroyed, I can't say. I don't know.

Chakka, If I'm in any doubt, I prefer to say 'I don't know'. Father Christmas, I think we can be fairly sure, was invented by man. Even his costume was designed, I believe, to enhance an advert for something like Coca Cola. Fairies and elves on the other hand - who knows? Perhaps you should leave your shoes out tonight just in case. :o)

I'm away with the fairies to start dinner now.

[luna-tic]

I think the word death is only a description of our physical end on this planet. Life which includes the physical body and soul which encompasses the enlightened being/s we should become continues through the spirit or life force until it has reached a certain state of perfection.
I don't know if that's true, I can't prove it but that appeals to my way of being.

[mibn2cweus]

When it comes down to �proof� we all have to decide for ourselves the degree and quality of proof that for each of us justifies our beliefs. For myself 96% certainty in regard to such a crucial issue as �life-after-death�, for or against, would not do. I need not only to scrutinize the implications of such issues thoroughly but to comprehend the basis from which certainty itself is derived and firmly assess the strength of the foundation on which it rests.

Admitting when one doesn�t know is only the first step in determining whether a belief corresponds to reality. Fabricating �entities� or �ideas� such as �gods�, �ghosts�, �ferries�, disembodied �souls� or �life-after-death� far from providing an explanation constitutes voluntary self-eviction from the realm where acquiring proof to justify ones beliefs is possible.

The true nature of reality is neither revealed nor defined by a vote. Nor is the absolute immutable nature of reality contrived by or altered through seeking or obtaining a consensus, regardless of the percentage.

Reality is not an oath one takes and then follows blindly. Reality is a constantly changing realm that follows the dictates of unyielding and unwavering laws of causality. Unraveling the consistently reliable aspects of reality from those that are subject to change or interpretation provides us with a framework from which to determine what is real and the course of action that will lead us to our desired destination as well as a solid platform from which to embark on our journey to acquire knowledge. The belief that one is adhering to and in accord with reality is confirmed by how reality ultimately plays out. Foreseeing and preparing for this inevitable future should be the aim of our thoughts and actions.

cont. . .

[mibn2cweus]

I know with absolute certainty that I am alive and without reservation see no justification for doubt because without life I have no reason for or means with which to believe in anything. I also know that I am only alive for a limited time and to wager that I might be alive after I die is a gamble I need not take to beat the odds that determine whether I�ll still be alive and well tomorrow. Consideration of such a gamble is no more than a diversion stacking the odds against my favor.

Having little regard for the potential of ones own mind to unravel the truth and the cost already incurred in acquiring the knowledge gained so far in ones life exacts a stiff penalty on ones ability to retain objectivity. I have invested a great deal of time and thought in achieving the certainty that without a healthy functioning brain and an unyielding respect for rationality that allowed me to achieve it, I would know absolutely nothing at all, ever. To throw it all away on a wish that is impossible to realise would be a crime of no less magnitude than brutal premeditated murder, such a choice would amount to mindless intellectual suicide.

I also realise that unless or until you have made a similar investment in unveiling the true nature of reality for yourself, all that I have mentioned here has no more validity or factual worth for you than hearsay and as such is unlikely to garner a fraction of the remaining 4% of your doubt. Believe what you wish but neither seeking nor finding a consensus for your beliefs provide the certainty of proof and an attempt to rewrite or append to reality to suit ones beliefs constitutes nothing more than the fiction of self-delusion.

Reason is the glue that unites a healthy heart and mind. I wish you success in sorting it all out and hope you have a nice day!

[Theland]

Mibs - You put such importance on retaining you objectivity, and in doing so have concluded the nature of your reality is underpinned by causality.
Fair enough. But you cannot find any means whatsoever for discovering the primal cause for all things, and the primal reason for our existence, or the primal goal of it all.
Yes, you have said that your upbringing involved scary postulations of an eternity in hell for something you didn't do and had no part in.
Well that's reasonable and undoubtedly your mentors in that field have a lot to answer for.
Nevertheless, their flawed teachings did try to impart the knowledge that there was more to life than the rather shallow one you describe.
Your faith in science is admirable, and you so often demonstrate what a great mind you have, but shouldn't it bother you that your failure to address the ultimate cause, or find a route to the answer, reduces you own certainties to less tha 100%?

[Theland]

Fender - You've just got to tell me more.
WHY do you believe there is more than this miserable finite existence?

[mibn2cweus]

Theland, Don't assume my life is shallow based on your refusal to search the depths of your own life's meaning. And don't assume that science requires faith based on your failure to examine the source for and methods used to validate, question and reconfirm its findings.

I have asked the fundamental questions about the meaning and purpose of life and the roots and basis of knowledge. The answers I have found were not obtained by a leap of faith but by insisting on understanding the reasons.

Existence is not a question but a self-evident primary, an axiom without which no awareness, questions or answers are possible.

Until you learn to think in terms of absolute, self-evident primaries, the words you use to describe and conceptualise reality are nothing more than floating abstractions with no basis in reality leaving your mind unrestrained by facts or reason, impenetrable, incomprehensible and completely unable to fathom what I would otherwise attempt to communicate.

I hope you also have a nice day, even if such would also be in conflict with your interpretation and evaluation of existence.