Before Christ

[claymore]

If there were no Christians before the birth of Jesus Christ, what were the major religions of the time before his birth?.....Were there any?

[keyplus90]

According to Bible Jesus was born and Adam was created. Fine then according to Bible Jews are right that he was born to ordinary parents. But Christians long after it all happened, started believing in God�s contribution. As far as Muslims are concerned they believe that it was God�s Will to bring Jesus into this world that way. God gave him ability to speak to people even when he was in cradle. What was logic behind that? You imagine a young girl comes to you with a new born child and say that it happened with the will of God. How many will believe in her? All of the human would have no doubt that she has been involved sexually with someone. And that is the reason God did not forsake her to answer unanswerable questions. But surely many will believe when they will see a child of few days talking and saying that he was sent by God. Just put yourself in place of people at that time around Mary.

As for your question about Test. You tell me what do you think is the purpose of this life? And I will tell you what I mean by test.

[naomi24]

Keyplus, No, Jews are not right �according to the bible� - they are right according to you. The bible says that God was the father of Jesus.

You say that long after it all happened, Christians started believing in God�s contribution, but Muslims who came much later, and were consequently even farther removed from the event, started believing in God�s contribution too, so what�s your point?

Muslims may believe that Jesus spoke from the cradle, but there�s no logic in it whatsoever, just as there is no logic in a woman becoming pregnant without the necessary biological processes taking place. You ask how many would believe it. Plenty, it seems, but I can�t imagine why, since there is nothing to support any of it. You may as well believe Grimms Fairy Tales with their magical, fanciful stories.

I have no idea what you�re talking about when you say God didn�t forsake her to answer unanswerable questions. Err �.what are you talking about?

I�ve asked the questions about the tests several times now without receiving answers. Nevertheless, I�ll do you the courtesy of addressing your question, and then, perhaps I�ll get my promised answers. I don�t think there is a specific purpose to this life. It�s as simple as that.

[Octavius]

Will somebody please answer my question?

[keyplus90]

Where in Bible it is said that God was Jesus(pbuh) father?

And for you answer I have said before that there is no answer for you because whatever someone would say you would go against it. Negative mentality as I said. You remind me one of my employer during my student life.

"Stack all these bed sheets on the shelves" I did that.
"Why did you stack all these sheets on the shelves as I did not spend hundereds of pounds on shelves for the bed sheets" I removed them.

"If there are no bed sheets on the shelves then how would we sell them"

So few people are so daft that you just can't win.



I don�t think there is a specific purpose to this life. It�s as simple as that.

If that is what you believe then you do not have to worry about any test. But you will be reminded when time will come. So do not worry.

[naomi24]

As requested, I answered your question, but still you refuse to answer mine. Or perhaps you can't, and you won't admit it. Clearly your word is not to be trusted, Keyplus.

If you want to know where the bible says that God is the father of Jesus, read the New Testament.

[keyplus90]

Why can't you give me a reference? Or I can give you a reference that God had another Son according to Bible. Did Jesus had a brother? Any Idea?

[naomi24]

Keyplus, no one who knows the bible needs links from you. I will tell you that Jesus did have brothers, but none are reputed to have been sons of God. If you want to know more, and get it right, read it yourself. You might just learn something that Islam doesn't teach.

Yet again, this is a one-sided discussion where your only real response is to tell me I have a negative mentality, and to issue dire warnings of the punishment that you think awaits me, and it's becoming tedious. If you want to carry it on, feel free, but talk to someone else. I'm bored with your superstitious claptrap.

[Octavius]

So.... are we up to date on you both answering each others questions now....?

[keyplus90]

31:9 They shall come with weeping, and with supplications will I lead them: I will cause them to walk by the rivers of waters in a straight way, wherein they shall not stumble: for I am a father to Israel, and Ephraim is my firstborn.

Does this mean Son of God or something else?

[chakka35]

Jesus was certainly not the Messiah, a Jewish concept which had nothing to do with being the son of God or performing miracles.

The Messiah would be an ordinary mortal who, sometime during his life, would be chosen by God (The Chosen One, The Annointed One) to bring about the Kingdom of God on earth - for Jews only of course: God cared nothing for gentiles.

Jesus did not qualify. Far from ridding Israel of the Roman occupiers so that it could settle down as God's own country, he was killed by them. Then Paul, in creating Christianity, invented a new type of Messiah - son of God, miracle-worker, risen from the dead. (But not born of a virgin, you'll note; that story had to wait many years before being told by the unknown authors of Luke and Matthew near the end of the 1st Century.)

So maybe people should talk of the Jewish Messiah and the Christian Messiah so as not to confuse the two.
If it matters, that is.

[keyplus90]

Octavius � Don�t worry, you haven�t answered my question is a very well known slogan of Naomi. I am sure you are aware of it as are many others here. Because just by adding isn�t it, haven�t that, wouldn�t it shouldn�t it, couldn�t it���..etc etc, Naomi believes people must answer everything. Once answered then she would say. It hasn�t been answered because it is not what she knew or she wanted it to be. So life is difficult.

[Octavius]

Perhaps that came down translation again chakka. The word khristos in Greek usage meant covered in oil (maybe, anointed), and is probably the route of our Germanic word �grease�. Thus �Christ� was a literal translation of �Messiah�.

Keyplus, you haven�t answered my question.

Is a recurring theme.

[naomi24]

There are many theories on the true identity of Jesus. Some say he was an Essene, others say he was a Zealot, which is possible, since not only did he lose his temper and create havoc amongst the money-changers at the temple, he once told his disciples to sell their cloaks to buy swords, so not always as gentle as some like to imagine, perhaps. There is also an intriguing theory that, as a descendant of the House of David through his father (Joseph - not God), he may have been the rightful King of the Jews and executed for political rather than religious reasons - hence Pilate, being aware his true status, ordered the legend �King of the Jews� to be nailed to the cross. Whatever he was, he wasn�t the Messiah the Jews were expecting to free them from Roman occupation, and if he was, then he failed in his quest, so perhaps we should make the distinction between the Jewish and the Christian Messiah, as Chakka suggests. There is certainly a very marked difference between the two.

[chakka35]

Octavius, 'Christ' is certainly synonymous with 'Messiah', which is why, to the Jews, Jesus is not the Christ.