Sir David Attenborough and Genesis.

[Lonnie]

I read this today and couldn't help wondering what you all think of it.

Personally, I agree with every word.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news /attenborough-genesis-it-can-go-forth-and-mult iply-1521668.html

[beso]

You agree with David Attenboroubh or Catherine Pepinster?

I agree with Attenborough. The Biblical rubbish is incredibly anthropocentric. How incredibly arrogant to believe we are created in the image of God and the world and everything on it is here for us to exploit as we like.

Pepinster is just another believer trying to reinterpret the primitive Biblical attitudes into something more palatable to modern philosophy. Just like those who try to twist Genesis into matching the geological record by reinterpreting the meaning of a day.

[naomi24]

Yes, Lonnie, I agree with him too.

That bit from the bible about man being created in the image of God is very worthy of serious consideration. Since evolution is a fact of life, and man has evolved fairly considerably over time, I have to wonder what God looks like. Something similar to an amoeba, perhaps?

[Theland1]

When I've had a few cans, I wal;k like Galen from "Planet Of The Apes!"
Does that help?

[evedawn]

Naomi my opinion is taht when the bible talks about us being created in the image of God I take it to mean we ourselves are a trinity...
Body, spirit, soul... just as God is Father, Son, Spirit.

[naomi24]

Evedawn, Are the spirit and the soul not the same thing? And do you think the earliest life forms would have possessed a spirit/soul?

[evedawn]

Hi naomi - My opinion, is that the Soul is your life force. This dies when you do. .
The spirit is the driving force for the desire of knowledge. Your soul is conscious, your spirit sub-conscious. This is only speculation though. Just something to think about.

Also the i think the very earliest life forms would have had a soul, (ie "life force") but not a spirit.

interested to hear what anyone else thinks.

[123everton]

^^Sounds a bit like Shinto.^^

[evedawn]

Shinto? u mean the japanese religion?

[123everton]

Yes, Japan's state religion, everything upon the earth has a soul, dogs, cats, cars (all Japanese cars have a "face" smiley ones usually) , cows, people, flowers, trees, stones....
it's a nice idea, but you have to qualify that with the bushido code of Imperial Japan of the 1920s, 30s and 40s.
It's claimed that bushido was an ancient practice but in reality it was a revisionist policy, look at the treatment of German P.O.Ws in Tsingtao (northern China) during the Great War and you'll see.
The maltreatment of foreign nationals disapeared in the mid 19th century after America threatened Japan with war if it harmed it's shipwrecked sailors, it was around about the same time that Japan chose to modernise.
Coincidentally if you look up western policy in northern China after the Great War you'll see that it brought down the governmennt of Yuen Shih Kai (because of the 21 demands) and restored Sun Yaet Sen, Tsingtao was the starting point of the Sino Japanese war of 1933 to 1945, the actions of the Japanese in this conflict alone made the Nazis look like nurses.

[evedawn]

very informative 123everton. i don't know much about shinto at all so it was interesting to seee what you know about the religioni. my opinion re soul / sprit isn't based on shinto thought it's based on the Christian upbringing I had and what I (personallY thinbk makes sensee to me.

[naomi24]

So this is your own idea, evedawn? Interesting. What's your rationale for believing that?

[evedawn]

it's not an original idea naomi. like I said it's what I learnt eons ago as a child and for me it makes sense. the body dies, when it dOes the soul (the life force which makes us live, and the individual personality traits which make us unique,) dies with it, there is a 3rd thing - spirit - which survives forever. I know some will question it, others will disbelieve it entirely...and everyone can decide themselves. however, i felt no need to question and disect the idea. it works for me...

[naomi24]

evedawn, I'm trying to understand this concept. So if the soul which comprises the life force and all the individual personality traits dies, what does the spirit comprise? Are all spirits identical, and devoid of individuality in every respect?

[evedawn]

sorry i've not replied sooner. i'd had gone offline. naomi u ask excellent questions and it really gets me thinking...

i am not thinking this from an academic viewpoint but to me the spirit is the inate part of everybody that seeks the truth, the spirit is also our conncience. every human being has a conscience o a sense of right and wrong...the "degree" of which can v ary from person to person. i think that everyone is born with the my identical spirit...it is part of belonging to the human race. but some of us learn to shut off, or accentuate differing aspects perhaps? but it is still there in our subcouncious. hmm u do get me thinking...

[Lonnie]

Yes beso, With David Attenborough. and I agree with what you say.

Hi naomi, Yes, man being made in the image of God does conjure up some images, may even look like somone who a few years ago, would have been in a freak show, they were, and are human.

Hi Theland, good to see you on here, hope you had a good birthday.

evedawn, Thats one explanation out many, and every one manmade., but if you truly believe it, then full marks. Has God explained what he meant?.

[123everton]

Eve if that is how you relate to your God, then that's great.
If it brings you comfort, understanding and happiness then that's wonderful.
The point I'm making is that many people promote eastern spiritulism as the most peaceful religion going.
Yet deny the brutal violence of Asian wars and Asian rulers.
Tibet for example was a horrible place to live under the Dalai Lama.
For your sins you could be locked into a box with just your head and one arm sticking out this meant you could be carried around with your nomadic group, your son could be forced to become a monk and get promptly bug gered by the other monks, the punishment for being a communist (during the civil war) involved being locked in a cage (bare breasted for a woman) and hung with enough rope to allow you to breathe standing on your tip toes.
This was the culture of the east.
All politicians and all religions espouse peace, but people will always find verses within this to wage wars.

[naomi24]

evedawn, your theory sounds pretty complex to me, and so I have to ask the questions that spring immediately to my mind - but thanks for that. I'm pleased I got you thinking. So what you're saying is that the conscience is separate from the rest of our psyche, and that, being the only thing left of us when we die, becomes our eternal spirit? Is that right?

[123everton]

Muddying the water a bit there Wiz, they're mentally il.
Even so they will have a sense of right and wrong just not one we'd recognise as valid.
They will have a conscience also they just don't listen to it, so her philosophy would stand up to that scrutiny to my mind.
Blood transfusion etc is more to do with morality, morality is a subjective value not an objective reasoning.
Different strokes for different folks.

[naomi24]

Jehovah's Witnesses refusal to accept blood transfusions has nothing to do with morality. They take their instruction directly from the bible.