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Is your god evil?
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Of all the evil thoughts that the human mind has conceived is there any more vile and prejudicially divisive than to harbour a belief that the universe was deliberately created and intentionally designed for the sole purpose and with the full and certain knowledge that some would live eternally in the undreamed and unmerited bliss of heaven with the very same monster that condemned the rest to endure the unendurable torture of everlasting hell? Of all the actions one could choose, why bother to speculate about one that approaches the depravity of worshiping an entity capable of carrying out such a devious and whimsically unjust scheme? Where within the history of reason has any believer ever suffered disproportionately to the crime of entertaining and promoting such beliefs?
Dare I ask of any or each and every one of you, your thoughts relating to these matters? Just to be fair, be pre warned that I will be scrutinising your answers carefully for each and every breach of reason and justifiability and that beyond this warning 'fairness' (as arbitrarily as you may wish to define it) will not necessarily be a consideration . . .
Dare I ask of any or each and every one of you, your thoughts relating to these matters? Just to be fair, be pre warned that I will be scrutinising your answers carefully for each and every breach of reason and justifiability and that beyond this warning 'fairness' (as arbitrarily as you may wish to define it) will not necessarily be a consideration . . .
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Interesting question.
First, its God that gave us a 'supposedly' free will, so everything, good and bad, can be laid at his door.
Second, in the Bible, Old Testament/Torah, (I haven't read The Quran, just bits), God is a selfish God, a Killer and Dictator.
Fourth, God is supposed to have created everything, so that also includes the Devil, and don't forget, Earth was given to him as his domain, by God.
I believe, that if, and its a big if, there really is a God, then he's not just evil, he's pure evil.
First, its God that gave us a 'supposedly' free will, so everything, good and bad, can be laid at his door.
Second, in the Bible, Old Testament/Torah, (I haven't read The Quran, just bits), God is a selfish God, a Killer and Dictator.
Fourth, God is supposed to have created everything, so that also includes the Devil, and don't forget, Earth was given to him as his domain, by God.
I believe, that if, and its a big if, there really is a God, then he's not just evil, he's pure evil.
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My dad says I'm a God amongst insects and I am a cruel and heartless God in this respect. ;0)
Ok, ok... Well just supposing I brought in to any of it then I suppose you could add in to the mix that a deity can have no comprehension of love, suffering, evil etc... as these are human traits. Therefore it's neither cruel or kind, it just is.
Ok, ok... Well just supposing I brought in to any of it then I suppose you could add in to the mix that a deity can have no comprehension of love, suffering, evil etc... as these are human traits. Therefore it's neither cruel or kind, it just is.
Of all the evil thoughts that the human mind has conceived is there any more vile and prejudicially divisive than to harbour a belief that the universe was deliberately created and intentionally designed for the sole purpose and with the full and certain knowledge that some would live eternally in the undreamed and unmerited bliss of heaven with the very same monster that condemned the rest to endure the unendurable torture of everlasting hell?
No. (Have I passed the reason test?). :o)
JNO's post is interesting. He/she says people don't believe because they think, but because they feel, and that's true. Ultimately the feeling they experience is fear of the reality of their own mortality, and an inability to accept the inevitable. Regardless of the cruelty of the perceived penalty that non-believers will ultimately suffer, and despite the required voluntary abandonment of one's individual intellect, believers are likely to continue to believe because fear suppresses, and often completely negates, rational thought.. Fairness isn't a consideration when it comes to the idea of saving their own skins(?).
Infundibulum, so we're all on Big Brother then? Ah, at last! My fifteen minutes of fame! Smile - ding!
No. (Have I passed the reason test?). :o)
JNO's post is interesting. He/she says people don't believe because they think, but because they feel, and that's true. Ultimately the feeling they experience is fear of the reality of their own mortality, and an inability to accept the inevitable. Regardless of the cruelty of the perceived penalty that non-believers will ultimately suffer, and despite the required voluntary abandonment of one's individual intellect, believers are likely to continue to believe because fear suppresses, and often completely negates, rational thought.. Fairness isn't a consideration when it comes to the idea of saving their own skins(?).
Infundibulum, so we're all on Big Brother then? Ah, at last! My fifteen minutes of fame! Smile - ding!
I don't think that can work, China. We're supposedly made in this God's image, so I assume he experiences the same emotions as us - although, going on his track record, the love bit is hard to believe. We know without doubt he feels anger and jealousy - he told us so - and just to prove it, he demonstrated the effects of those emotions.
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My apologies for getting sidetracked investigating the "Christadelphians". Looks like I have a bit of catching up to do.
Infundibulum, I hesitate to pronounce due retribution in your case as I am no match for that which by all rights must fester in your own imagination. ;o) But I will offer that I find the abstraction of a �Benign God� in ' the Holy Books '�or elsewhere plagued by contradiction.
By the way, which planet do you hail from? ;o)
Infundibulum, I hesitate to pronounce due retribution in your case as I am no match for that which by all rights must fester in your own imagination. ;o) But I will offer that I find the abstraction of a �Benign God� in ' the Holy Books '�or elsewhere plagued by contradiction.
By the way, which planet do you hail from? ;o)
China China China China China. What to do? What to do?
What cruelty a father, however well intentioned, can inflict upon an incomprehensible daughter.
Like the deity you describe, reality has no comprehension of love, suffering, evil etc. apart from these human traits that arise from an existence that relies on the ability to make the choices that insure and promote our existence. Reality is neither cruel or kind, it simply�is.�
It is only those whose existence is conditional, whose capacity to experience love and joy must be protected from and defended against suffering that the ability to differentiate between good and evil, thereby defined, and the need to benefit from such knowledge exists. Ascribing such attributes to a being whose existence is unconditional and who can achieve any goal on a whim is meaningless and defies all comprehension and understanding of reality.
Apart from the necessity of and benefits derived from being rational, there is no reason to be reasonable nor any reason for anything else to exist. We along with any other rationally dependant beings that might exist throughout the universe, by virtue of our awareness and knowledge of it, give meaning to an otherwise pointless and arbitrary universe.
What cruelty a father, however well intentioned, can inflict upon an incomprehensible daughter.
Like the deity you describe, reality has no comprehension of love, suffering, evil etc. apart from these human traits that arise from an existence that relies on the ability to make the choices that insure and promote our existence. Reality is neither cruel or kind, it simply�is.�
It is only those whose existence is conditional, whose capacity to experience love and joy must be protected from and defended against suffering that the ability to differentiate between good and evil, thereby defined, and the need to benefit from such knowledge exists. Ascribing such attributes to a being whose existence is unconditional and who can achieve any goal on a whim is meaningless and defies all comprehension and understanding of reality.
Apart from the necessity of and benefits derived from being rational, there is no reason to be reasonable nor any reason for anything else to exist. We along with any other rationally dependant beings that might exist throughout the universe, by virtue of our awareness and knowledge of it, give meaning to an otherwise pointless and arbitrary universe.
madmaggot, Had to look that up
A Sexist! . . . hmmm???
Damn if that one hasn't already been claimed.
A Sexist! . . . hmmm???
Damn if that one hasn't already been claimed.
"Is your god evil?"
Aren't they all? I have yet to learn of a benevolent god that rewards its followers with well earned peace and prosperity for undisputed and faithful compliance. All have inflicted their terrible wrath undeservedly upon the mortals who worship them, usually for the most obscure and ridiculous reasons.
Having really tried to understand the hypothesis of religion, I can not get past believing that supernatural powers are akin to a fable of giant proportions.
You have not asked about goddesses....... does Xena count?
Aren't they all? I have yet to learn of a benevolent god that rewards its followers with well earned peace and prosperity for undisputed and faithful compliance. All have inflicted their terrible wrath undeservedly upon the mortals who worship them, usually for the most obscure and ridiculous reasons.
Having really tried to understand the hypothesis of religion, I can not get past believing that supernatural powers are akin to a fable of giant proportions.
You have not asked about goddesses....... does Xena count?
And again in English please toots... (Sorry, didn't quite get all that but then I'm speed reading).
Also, just in case it was of any interest to anyone, not only are sticky and zappy not talking to each other at the moment making getting on to the internet quite difficult, one has also got a new look of late... Do you have anything to say about the Gods of the AB world? ;0)
Also, just in case it was of any interest to anyone, not only are sticky and zappy not talking to each other at the moment making getting on to the internet quite difficult, one has also got a new look of late... Do you have anything to say about the Gods of the AB world? ;0)
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