Turning your back on your faith

[naomi24]

If turning your back on your faith would guarantee everlasting peace in this world, would you do it?

[Zabadak]

Hi Naomi -thanks for the response. Don't you think that's a very narrow definition of faith? I can only see the transaction in these terms making any sense in the most extreme jihadist sense. My "faith" has very little to do with expectations of an afterlife.

[naomi24]

Zabadak, No, I don't think it's a narrow definition. I think it's a factual definition. You say your faith has 'very little to do with the afterlife', but what does 'very little' mean? Both Christianity and Islam are founded on the promise of an afterlife so do you believe your soul will survive corporal death or not? Your answer doesn't make it clear.

[Zabadak]

While I still find it very difficult to understand how giving up any hope of an afterlife would in any way affect the peace of the world (or even a small bit of it), I am very much more interested in the kind of faith that is built on a present relationship, something that informs day to day living in the life that we know something about now. Tomorrow, and any tomorrows after that, can take care of themselves.
I think we might find some agreement in not being too thrilled with any religion that plays on fears of the fires of hell or promises of virgins in heaven (whatever good they may be!) to dragoon the faithless into the fold. I've never been too happy with that as a method.
Do I believe my soul will survive corporeal death? I think you'll find my lot believe in the resurrection of the body, but I'm not alone in thinking that it'll be interesting finding out what that really means when we get there. You can put an if in that sentence if you want!
PS I'n not dead yet - I don't want to go on the cart 8-)

[naomi24]

Christadelphian?

[ummmm]

We're still having this argument. My 12 year old told me that I'm going to hell.

The thing I'm finding hard to turn my back on is the afterlife. When my Dad died I comforted myself with the fact I would see him again. The thought that I might not is quite heart breaking.

[naomi24]

ummmm, oh my goodness! That's awful! I'm appalled to hear that from your son. Your mother's influence? Has to be doesn't it?

As for the afterlife, despite what anyone tells you, no one knows - they really don't. Not the priests, not the Imams, nor the atheists. No one. The real problem with religion for me arises from the psychopathic nature and the very limited capabilities of the bloke the Abrahamic religions tell me is the Almighty because he simply doesn't meet expectations. Now whether or not there is a genuine Almighty is another question, but if there is I very strongly suspect that it doesn't concern itself with us on a personal level as religion would have us suppose. I mean, honestly, can you believe that something that magnificent, that tremendous, that powerful, really cares about what we eat or what we wear? Although religion insists on telling us who live on this speck of dust that we're the bees knees as far as this vast universe goes, I have a sneaking suspicion we're not. All I can say is we need to think much bigger than religion because there is far more to nature than we can currently possibly imagine. Whilst there's every reason to reject the fear imposed by the men who continue to promote the lie of the cruel imposter that is Abraham's monster, my personal experiences leave me no alternative but to believe the soul survives corporal death, and therefore in my opinion there's no reason whatsoever to relinquish your belief in your dad's eternal love for you, or in your hopes for a happy reunion in the future. x

[ummmm]

It is Mums influence. He hasn't been to hers since the last time I posted. I still let him go to the church youth club and Mass. He enjoys it and wants to go.

I'm glad to read your opinions on the afterlife. I so hope so. I think I loved him a bit too much..

[naomi24]

Many of us do that ummmm - but there's nothing wrong with love. It's the most important thing in this world. :o)

[Sqad]

naomi

<<<they really don't. Not the priests, not the Imams, nor the atheists. No one. <<<

;-)...agreed.

However there is a phrase in Law that confronts the same problem as you have quoted above and that is "likelier than not" which solves many legal problems.

In my opinion,it is "likelier than not" that there is not an after life, but supporters of the "faith"would say the opposite.
I don´t think that one can go further than that.

You mention "love" that once again is difficult to define, so we are faced with two imponderables.

[ummmm]

It's not difficult to define when you know what it feels like.

It might be difficult to put into words.

[naomi24]

Sqad, you're talking about the principle of Occam's Razor - a best guess answer - and therefore not accurate and hence, in my opinion, not good enough. ;o)

[Sqad]

naomi....for me, it is "the only show in town" as there is no direct scientific evidence ( at the moment) for the establishment of fact.
But hey! that is the beauty of "faith" it need not be based on fact.

[ummmm]

my personal experiences leave me no alternative but to believe the soul survives corporal death

That's not based on any fact..!

[Sqad]

ummmm

<<my personal experiences<<

Describe....if you want to.

[sandyRoe]

When you're all roasting in the bubbling lake of fire you'll wish then that you listened to people like me who tried to guide you to eternal salvation.

[ummmm]

That was a quote from Naomi Sqad. Should have put <<>>

[naomi24]

Sqad, waddaya mean it need not be based on fact? It's never based on fact.

Ummmm, since I have no evidence, I can't claim it is based on fact. I can only claim it to be my personal experience.

Sandy, tut! Dunnit all wrong again! :o)

[Zabadak]

Naomi <Christadelphian?> I'm kinda flattered, but not sure they'd be. The "resurrection of the body" is in all the major versions of the Christian creed (as I'm sure you know). What that means is another discussion, probably with as many answers as there are people to discuss. I can cheerfully wait to find out the true answer.

[Marijn]

Sandy, were you a nun in your previous life?

[ummmm]

Yes..and so many people claim to have had an experience that I feel that maybe that aspect of things should stop worrying me.