How do cherry-picking believers decide what to believe?

[chakka35]

One would think that a person who could think rationally would be consistent about it. But this seems not to be so. Below is a thread about a chap who rejects God but believes in an afterlife, even though both beliefs have a similar irrational status.

How many other cases are there? People who, for example, reject astrology but believe in Tarot cards; who reject dowsing but accept ouija boards; who reject crystal balls but accept ESP; who reject weeping statues but accept alien abductions; who reject fairies but accept angels…..and so on. How do they discriminate between one lot of nonsense and another? What criteria do they use?

I anticipate one possible answer: a believer (naomi perhaps?) might say that she believes in ghosts because she has seen one. But this cannot always be the answer, surely. What is?

[naomi24]

Mibs, I haven't read that thoroughly, but I will later when I have a bit more time. I just wanted to say in response to the final sentence that I would dearly love for one of you guys to give me a rational explanation for some of the stuff I've experienced. I really would, I don't WANT to believe it's been caused by something that nobody understands but I simply have no alternative. Any offers?

Sorry, must dash - cooking dinner - or possibly burning it!!

[ludwig]

// ludwig, you don't have to file ESP (for example) under 'pending for now' especially as you confess to knowing little about it. There is plenty of information about the controlled tests done on alleged ESP, all of which show that there is no such thing. Isn't it better to empty your 'pending' tray rather than be lazy about it? //

Well, it' precisely because I don't know much about it that I have no choice but to remain undecided - can you follow that logic?. I suppose I could take your word for it on the ESP thing though....on second thoughts, no, probably best not to.

You just strike me as an intolerant person. It seems to annoy the hell out of you that there are people who have different opinons to you - that haven't got your list above neatly filed under 'nonsense' and a corresponding list of truths that agrees entirely with yours.

[mibn2cweus]

Yes, by all means breathe . . . and eat. Although some might question or dismiss the essential requirement of life to achieve an understanding of the process. ;o)

No rush Naomi, I don't think that ghost of ours is going anywhere soon. Thankfully you've removed yourself from any immediate perceived threat so no need to act on impulse. First things first, let's figure out where we stand in relation to our ability to understand each other.

[mibn2cweus]

. . . after dinner of course ;o)

[naomi24]

Mibs, I don't find it too difficult to understand you. It seems to me that like Chakka, as long as you don't have to encounter and deal with anything that might fall outside your preferred world image, you're happy.

[mibn2cweus]

Naomi, We live in a world possessed with people who for unsubstantiated ‘reasons’ I’m still unable to comprehend hold to indeterminate beliefs, (and not only beliefs in God), for which, believe it or not, they do not stop at using the threat to inflict physical pain and to do bodily harm to defend. That is far from any view of a world I would have ever cared to imagine had it not slapped me across the face.

No Naomi, you don’t understand me at all and I’ve come to the hard founded grievously disappointing conclusion that you never will. But that’s ok. I’ve obviously misjudged you as well, so . . . we’re even.

[woofgang]

naomi, you have just described the human state!!

[mibn2cweus]

I think your broad brush might be shy a few bristles there woofgang.

[naomi24]

mibs, well, I'm not sure who you're talking about, or what it has to do with this discussion, but clearly I've failed more miserably than I'd imagined.

Woofgang, sadly, I believe I have.

[Ankou]

"Our friends are not those who support our world view without questioning what that world view entails. Our true friends are those with the courage to question, examine and evaluate each others world view in an effort to understand it and thereby themselves and each other better."

never a truer word said. but anecdotes are not evidence, no matter how good a friend one would always have the right to question and challenge a claim should they woish, trivial or . if the friend is offended by this, then it must be their attitude to the friendship which is questioned.

[naomi24]

The problem doesn't arise where my friends are concerned. They are well aware that they are welcome to question me, but you may rest assured that although they may not understand what has happened, they know me and therefore they do not doubt my word.

[Ankou]

well i'm delighted for you, but i wasn't drecting that at you personally.

i can't speak for your friends of course, but perhaps in your particular experience they may not doubt your word in what you believe you saw. but they might doubt what you saw was what you believed it was. and as woofgang said, it does them or you no harm to bleieve in you or to let you believe they do not doubt you.

[woofgang]

ankou I half agree with you. I also think a true friend would stop the questioning at once when asked to...no matter how true the friend they do not have the right to trample in all over my emotional intellectual and spiritual state.

[Ankou]

fair enough woofgang, but if a friend is capable of trampling all over your emotional, intellectual and spiritual beliefs, then either they would already not be a true friend prior to the quesitoning, or your conviction in your beliefs are not as solid as you would hope.

[naomi24]

Ankou, you weren't? Righto, but I think perhaps your experience of friendship and mine may be quite different.

Woofgang, I've never asked a friend to stop questioning me. They're welcome to ask me anything they like.

[Ankou]

"but I think perhaps your experience of friendship and mine may be quite different."

yes, or perhaps not. could be either.

[naomi24]

As I said, perhaps.

[Ankou]

i said perhaps first.

[woofgang]

as I posted earlier, yes my belief has not always been as strong as it is now. It is also very personal and no something i share or discuss easily. To me a large part of true friendship is a degree of acceptance....

[naomi24]

Ankou, please don't spoil another serious thread with your silliness.

Woofgang, //To me a large part of true friendship is a degree of acceptance.... //

I agree.