Selling A Deceased Persons Car

[gumboil]

My father-in-law died late last month and he owned a car. No finance was in place on the vehicle and since his death, it's been parked on a drive owned by him adjacent to his home. His Executor, my wife, has now to dispose of the car. No family member wants it, so we're thinking of returning it to the dealership. We've not contacted them to date to ask for a valuation for probate purposes.

I've a number of questions concerning the best way to go about this. As my father-in-law was disabled and received DLA, he did not pay road tax on the car. We've not notified the DVLA of his death. Does this mean that my wife cannot drive the vehicle on her fully comprehensive policy? She wasn't a named driver on his insurance policy. His insurance lapsed the day after he died. Does this make a difference? Is it true that under these circumstances, the only option we have is to ask the dealer to transport the vehicle from the drive to the dealership? Does it need a SORN?

Are there any benefits of not putting it through probate given what Solicitors charge these days?

Thank you

[hc4361]

SirOracle, a vehicle on the road with no insurance will flag up on passing police vehicles and cameras as being uninsured.
If it is not insured in its own right it MUST be declared SORN, and if it is SORN it can't be driven.

[ubasses]

With regard to Probate, the car is part of the Estate, if the total assets of the Estate are enough to require Probate then the value of the car must be included and cannot be sold until it received.

[Arrods]

I agree hc4361, but my point was it can still be insured under someone else's DOC cover.

[Peter Pedant]

Sir Orac
Your wife can't drive the car under her policy "driving other cars" section,as this extension on her policy is only for cars NOT belonging to her.

the position at present before probate is that the wife DOESN'T own the asset the executors do ( in trust ) Isnt that the Queensland Stmp Duty case?

but at present it is not taxed and so if she is gonna drive it she has to tax it

I would be interested in what turns out

[Arrods]

On reflection hc4361, I think you're right. If it's not SORNed, the vehicle itself still has to have insurance in its own right though that could be overcome by adding it temporarily to the other policy.

[SirOracle]

I was giving my opinion on the insurance position and not the SORN position. These are separate matters.

Driving without insurance is a considerably more serious offence than having no tax on the car.

[Peter Pedant]

Sir O

O sorry my point was that she doesnt own the car so it may be covered by DOC

Quuensland commissioners v Livingston 1965 PC 7
" In Australian law, as in English law, the property of someone who dies having left a will automatically vests in the deceased’s executors until they complete the administration of the estate and transfer the assets to those entitled under the deceased’s will. At the time when Mrs Coulson died, the title to all Mr Livingston’s property was therefore still held by his executors - they had not yet had time to complete the administration and transfer everything to the trustees to hold on trust for Mrs Coulsdon. "

[bhg481]

Let's look carefully at the original post:

The wife is the executor of the will, so now owns the car in trust. This means that, whatever her insurance cover is for driving other people's cars, she is not allowed to drive it as she is the owner.
The car is not insured in its own right, so cannot go on the road anyway.
The car is not taxed but the DVLA doesn't know that, as they haven't been told (they think it is still owned by dad and has tax, albeit at zero rate), so she would not be stopped for no tax.
Since she is the owner-in-trust, she should be able to get her own car insurance extended to cover dad's car. She could then drive it to the garage without danger of being stopped.

[EDDIE51]

There is a point others seem to have missed.
The car currently is registered as a road tax free 'disabled owner' car.
That has to be changed back to a normal 'taxed' registration group, before it can be insured again.
I would definately phone DVLA and make sure sure you talk to a real live person it can take a while but you can get through to one.. I had to do it when I sold my car that had been tax free 'disabled' registered.

[Peter Pedant]

Yes quite eddie
I must say I thought we had covered the bit where it wasnt now driven by the disabled and so had to be taxed with er money

[ I am also a disabled driver. actually I sit in the passenger seat and hit the driver and say - drive there damn you ! - but you kinda know what I mean ]

[gumboil]

Thank you all for your help.

[EDDIE51]

PP yes but you can't tax it with 'money' while it registered as tax free.
As the DVLA are aware of the death, possibly they will issue a new document with the correct tax cost but do not rely on it. One dept does not know what another is doing if my experience of the DVLA is typical. I once got a 'No road tax' fine for a car I had sold a year ago and had confirmation of transfer for!
When I sent them a copy of their 'confirmation of transfer' they didn't even have the grace to apologize, just sent a note saying they would cancel the fine 'on this occasion only'

[fiction-factory]

Regarding your final point which was "Are there any benefits of not putting it through probate given what Solicitors charge these days? "

If your wife is the executor I'm not clear where solicitors come into this.

[gumboil]

fiction-factory, Solicitors come into it because his home, which he owned outright, has to go through probate along with quite a few quid in assets. Bearing in mind that Solicitors charge by the half-hour or hour, I had in mind minimising the bill by excluding the car from the paperwork my wife presents to the solicitor. If we can process the car business ourselves, we'll save money on the final bill!

[fiction-factory]

Okay. I've never had to use solicitors when I've been an administrator but there has never been a house involved so maybe that's the reason you need to pay a solicitor (though i'm still not sure why, but I'll leave you to it). Good luck.

[ParsleyDumpling]

Hi gumboil,

You write that your FIL was in receipt of DLA and mention a car dealership, which tends to suggest the car was relatively new?
Do you know whether he was using the Motability Scheme because if he was getting the higher rate DLA for mobility issues the car may well have been on a three year lease to him (in which case the dealership would know).
It may be worth you finding out, and contacting Motability or looking through his paperwork for his DLA award notice.

Jan

[Retrochic]

I was thinking the same thing re DLA you may find out the car does not actually belong to him so best ring the dealership asap. There will be no 'finance' on the car because maybe the DLA is paying for the lease through the mobility scheme.