Kathryn Smith Assaulted In Prison

[agchristie]

Most people will probably say 'so what, it's the least she deserves' but should the prison, with their duty to protect all inmates, have staff who comment 'what goes round, comes round'?

Would such staff properly intervene if such views are held?

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/670415/Sick-mum-Kathryn-Smith-slashed-beaten-inmates-prison-Ayeeshia-Jane

[agchristie]

NJ > I was to suggest that somebody who burgled a pensioners house was so despicable I reserve the right to visit them in their cell and give them a good pasting, is that acceptable? Possibly not.

Substitute 'possibly' for 'definitely'.

Yes, some inmates have to demonstrate how above the law they actually are and dish out their own 'parallel justice'...

[Prudie]

NJ your repeat of the word honour - if that was picked up from my post I was not saying people in prison are honourable. I'm sure you are well aware of the long known idiom 'honour among thieves' and what it means.

[jambutty]

bodeker - you sold out !

[jno]

this prison houses Myra Hindley? I wasn't aware that jail sentences went on longer than life in the UK.

[bodeker]

Lol not really jambutty. You can't have prisoners going about attacking everybody at will. There has to be some order. But when I hear that one has been attacked for a awful crime as I said I just think "Hell mend you "

[cassa333]

This thread wasn't about what we think 'justice' should or could be meted out in prison but if the officers are fit for purposes if they think that she got what they deserved.

I bet you £100 at least 95% of officers think she did get what she deserved but 100% of them would have intervened to stop it.

There will always be areas that are not covered by CCTV. Actually they could do a lot of damage in full view of the officers and not be seen if they did it right.

[bodeker]

Oh don't start me on life sentences, in this country they are a joke.

[bodeker]

Think you are right cassa333.

[agchristie]

Yes, to clarify, I am exploring the question of the mindset of PO's insofar as: Is it acceptable to publicly state their views concerning the treatment of inmates in a negative light following an assault?

[bodeker]

Think the short answer to that is no. What they personally think has to be kept to themselves.

[EDDIE51]

Few if any of the posters on this thread have actually been inside a prison as I have, as I have said on many occasions I was a tutor in the education dept of a prison.
The staff have a terrible job , they have to protect all inmates but they really hate people like Kathryn Smith. Just for a start they make the job very difficult as the other inmates are so determined to hurt them. The few places where there is no CCTV cover will be well known to all the inmates, they will wait for an opportunity to hurt a prisoner such as this. Prisons are severely understaffed and moral of staff is at an all time low. It is impossible for the staff to watch and protect such an inmate 24 / 7 and every second of the day. The prisoners who inflicted the 'punishment' will be rewarded with tobacco sweets and food items by the other inmates and looked on as heroes. (or rather Heroines ) their status among the other inmates will be greatly increased. It is far from unknown for 'screws' to turn a blind eye for a few seconds so that such 'punishment' can be meted out. It make it a lot easier to keep control of the rest of the prisoners. I would also add that Women's prisons are far more violent than men's jails as only the very worst of female offender get sent to jail.

[EDDIE51]

She is lucky she only got a beating! Prison punishment for such prisoners includes such things as tiny fragments of broken glass and razor blades being hidden in their food and being 'Napalmed' a mixture of boiling water and sugar being tipped over them. The sugar makes the boiling point higher and sticks to the skin causing very severe burns with excruciating pain that are very difficult to heal.

[agchristie]

Eddie > Prisons are severely understaffed and moral of staff is at an all time low.

Morale I trust?!

Thanks for insight. Morale of staff is very low in a lot of workplaces and although likely to be true in the prison service they are being employed to carry out an important role albeit very difficult.

Some of your script is very disturbing and I don't doubt the authenticity of life inside. Do you know the extent of any investigation into the type of incident as reported here?

Kathryn Smith may have very few admirers but it would be highly reprehensible of the prison authorities if she is singled out for any less duty of care than anybody else.

[david small]

You lefties refuse to accept reality. What "should be" does not collate with what will be. In that environment she is a target. Like it or not. Solitary confinement, is an option. But her human rights would be compromised.

[agchristie]

david small > What "should be" does not collate with what will be.

Do you consider it correct that other prisoners have the right to enforce their own form of justice?

Should prison workers express their personal opinions publicly if the comments made in this case are true?

[EDDIE51]

Prison officers are forbidden by law from striking or taking industrial action.
I personally know several prison officers and they feel they have little respect or sympathy from the public. In face they consider that a sizable % of the public regard prison officers as little better than the inmates they are guarding. They are subject to a constant threat of violence from disgruntled inmates as well as criticism from the public, they feel they just can't win.

[david small]

My opinion on how fellow prisoners respond to those they are incarcerated with is irrelevant. It happens frequently, and given the opportunity always will.
Regarding staff opinions, they, professionally, should keep their comments to each other and the pub.

[agchristie]

Eddie > I personally know several prison officers and they feel they have little respect or sympathy from the public. In face they consider that a sizable % of the public regard prison officers as little better than the inmates they are guarding.

That is a very sad state of affairs.

[andy-hughes]

This type of question usually attracts an instant polarisation of views - but i am pleased to see that there are far more posts of reason and objectivity that are usually to be found.

I agree entirely with NJ's measured explanation of how and why the justice system works as it does - and also with AG who provides a similar level of appropriate detachment.

david small's assertion that 'lefties' cannot accept 'reality' is, in my view, wide of the mark.

Wishing for a state-sanctioned punishment is not the same as feeling sympathy for this woman, or an over-developed need to protect her human rights.

Feeling that the violence visited on her is wrong is not the same as thinking that it was equally not wrong for her to murder her child.

To see responses in that way is to over-simplify a complex moral argument, and fail to justly recognize that such posters have their own emotional reactions to the murder, and this incident.

But emotion and the legal system to not intertwine here, nor should they.

As far as the notion that staff have commented as quoted - that may be a misrepresentation of either the circumstances of what may have been said, or what was actually meant by it.

[agchristie]

Good post Andy.