Brexit: Government Suffers Second Defeat In Lords

[mikey4444]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39200658

Another defeat !

[emmie]

mikey think someone posted this earlier. result though.

[emmie]

http://www.theanswerbank.co.uk/News/Question1541882.html

[Gromit]

Will be reversed when the bill goes back to Commons.

[Jackdaw33]

P££sing in the wind comes to mind.

[emmie]

why will it be reversed.

[ToraToraTora]

so what happened to the last amendment then? Has that been ping ponged or what?

[mikey4444]

Thanks Emmie....I didn't realise that its already being posted.

[emmie]

mikey no problem..

[-Talbot-]

Isn't AOG's gloating different to mikey's gloating?

[Peter Pedant]

// so what happened to the last amendment then? Has that been ping ponged or what?//

no this is a further amendment
so once the Lords have finished mauling it

it then goes back to the commons for reversal

and I THINK it goes to the Lors again
and if they persist

then you wait for a year and it becomes law automatically without further ado

Not often done and the quality of the acts where they have been forced thro - Parliament Act 1949 and War Crimes Act 1994 dont inspire admiration

( war crimes - £90m expended and one failed prosecution)

[Old_Geezer]

One feels sure that the lower house will tell them to debate it again and stop messing about.

The democratic will of the people is at stake here, and one can not negotiate again and again forever, especially when an agreement had been reached at the table: which would be a possibility if the result of negotiations were not simply passed as a rubber stamp exercise. Eventually it would result in an exit with no agreements in place, going forward; and a lose/lose situation caused by those who insisted on a ridiculous veto.

[ichkeria]

The Lords want the commons to be able to vote on the final Brexit deal rather than have the government force it through: that sounds like democracy to me. The referendum was about leaving the eu, not the terms of leaving. That basic fact still seems to elude many

[jourdain2]

The Lords appear to be forcing us towards a Norwegian situation, in which everyone loses. They don't care about the expressed will of the people. They will then be able to sit back in the ensuing chaos and loss and smarm to each other that they said Brexit would be a disaster. Numbers subscribing to petitions have soared this evening. Then what happens? At this point people take to the streets. It is as serious as that.

[Zacs-Master]

Well said Ich. Some people have a frail grasp of the workings of our constitution and parliament in particular.

[Khandro]

// Some people have a frail grasp of the workings of our constitution and parliament in particular.//

Yes, and they are called Liberal Democrats.

[Old_Geezer]

It appears to me that it would only seem like democracy for someone trying to make out that they are naive.

It is clear that the out/in decision has already been democratically arrived at. So it have no need to be debated/discussed further.

The terms/agreements to put into place after the split are not dictatable but negotiated, so debate isn't relevant unless one is prepared to reject the agreement and have nothing in place when we leave, which hardly seems wise.

In any case if parliament isn't keen on the result of the talks it has the ability to get future government to renegotiate the bits that are not not popular at a later time.

So none of this is anything to do with democracy despite the aim to describe and claim it is so. So what is it for then ? Well that's clear isn't it ? It can only be a cynical attempt to cause trouble and try to prevent the the exit from occurring. And no one is really fooled by it.

[Gromit]

// Yes, and they are called Liberal Democrats. //

Both Houses of Parliament have majorities, and both have an opposition. You shouldn't really berate the opposition for trying even though it is a certainty they will lose.
People opposed the poll tax before it was passed, the Iraqi War vote and Ausrity cuts. The fact that something gets passed does not mean it will be successful, was right or will get cheered in the future. The LibDems and the Conservative and Labour remainers are getting their objections recorded. If things don't pan out as expected, they can remind us later.

[ichkeria]

Er, no currently all Parliament can do is reject the deal and cause a 'hard landing' exit. That is patently ludicrous, but it's a state of affairs caused by the current obsession with not wanting to offend people who, like I say, fail to grasp the difference between leaving the eu and the terms of leaving.
So we have a bizarre situation now where the commons will probably reject the lords amendment that is trying to empower it! Monty Python strikes again.
And another few thousand signatures go on the petition no doubt :-)

[mikey4444]

Lord Heseltine has been sacked apparently !

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39202245

I think he wouldn't give a hoot !