snapping dog

[carostarlite]

Hi I have adopted a 18month beardie cross dog from the humane society ,we already had a german shepard cross, 2yr old male and they get on very well . when we adopted the beardie he behaved very well for the first two weeks apart from defecating inside(he stays outside at night now). Then he started nipping/snapping at each and every one of us. We dealt with this by using as spray bottle, holding his muzzle shut and tying him up for periods of time. My youngest son (9)got the most nips but he feed him and trained him alot and up till today had not snapped at him or us .He has now started on other people and other dogs, he seems obssesed with our other dog and will not play with any other dogs he also follows me from room to room if I dont put him outside. any suggestions would be appreciated caroline

[divegirl]

Hi, please get some professional help with your dog or at the very least talk to the adoption society. There are many training techniques that you can use for this sort of behaviour, but restraining his mouth or tying him up are NOT among them. Have the dogs been neutered? I am assuming that the Beardie is if he came from rescue, if not this must be an option for maybe calming the situation [not always though]. You don't say how long you have had him in total..... He is probably still very nervous and shutting him outside is not the answer, you need to build his confidence. Talk to your vet about training classes.

Lisa x

Lankeela.......Where are you....this one needs your help!

[lankeela]

You really won't want my answer! In the first place I would not have rehomed another male with your male. Secondly I would not tolerate a dog snapping or nipping and would return it to the home, and thirdly I would not let you have a dog anyway if you do things like tying up and holding his muzzle shut.

There are plenty of books, organisations and internet sites that give advice on owning dogs, and I suggest you do the dog a favour, and return it to the home and learn how to treat a dog before you even contemplate getting another.

[divegirl]

Cheers hun!

[carostarlite]

i have spoken to the people at the rescue centre they gave me the dog knowing that i had another dog both are neuterd ,we have had the dog for 31/2 months and have rung the centre to find a behavouirist twice they have not got back to me yet, quite frankly your answer lankeela was not helpful my children and I love our dogs but are totally unable to tolerate the biting and he does come inside and during the day and recieve love affection walking and training ,but now he cannot come in with visitors here as he cannot be trusted.

[divegirl]

Hi, you've answered your own question there.....are you really happy to own a dog that you can not trust? You need to get professional help before the dog does some one some damage. Don't just say 'they don't ring back'.....Make them take some responsbility.

Lisa

[divegirl]

...would just like to add.....I don't doubt that you and your kids love the dogs......but is it worth the risk?

Lisa x

[carostarlite]

This is the dogs second rehome as he used to run away from the first one, I know he will not be given another chance if he goes back and he has lots of great qualities For the 2 months inbetween before starting to snap at stangers and other dogs he had been doing very well I just wanted to know if it was worth persisting with the help of a behaviorist or does snapping reoccur if dogs have used it before, we have a lot of vistors and with four children lots of them are the kids friends who rightly so are not wanting to have anything to do with the dog(yes they are well behaved kids). I put him in my room until they are gone, I think he has started protecting us and our dog, and now when I walk the dogs he wont allow other dogs to play with him or our other dog so I let the dogs off separately to be safe.

[carostarlite]

I have contacted a behavouirist and he sounds very positive about correcting the problems ,I just wanted say I will be posting here again and LANKEELA I will ignore your replies, as there is nothing in them of value and they are very nasty. A person who says a three old should keep his hands out of the letter box, and deserves to be bitten and tells people her own dogs are so out of control that they attack and eat the mail (re your other post) is not able to give advice to other people on training dogs. Quite frankly its dangerous So perhaps you could move on to another list and give other people who know more a chance to reply.

[lankeela]

If you can't stand the heat stay out of the kitchen.

[lankeela]

Just wonder how much the behaviourist will be charging?

[lankeela]

Just hope it does not come at the cost of the welfare of your children.

[kita1]

Firstly, the beardie has collie in him. They control animals (and people) by nipping or biting. He is NOT getting protective of you and your dog (I don't think your GSD needs protecting) he is CONTROLLING his pack. He is head of it and as such tells you where to go and what to do. The first two months were a 'honeymoon' period where he was learning all about you and how to become head of this new pack!

This is probably why he was in the rescue in the first place and probably why the other home returned him. (People never tell the real reason - they probably thought, like you that the home would put him to sleep).

This problem can almost certainly be cured, but it will take a long time and a lot of expense on your part. If you have so many children around your house can you really afford the risk? Is keeping a dog outside, or in your room everytime you have visitors really an option - what about the one time a child walks into the room where the dog is by mistake? Or goes up to him when he is tied outside?

I seen a very experienced behaviourist try and train a collie belonging to a family. This dog was doing the same thing you describe. The young son of the family was wearing wellingtons in the house because the dog nipped him everytime he moved. After many weeks of trying the trainer had to advise putting the dog to sleep, it was too risky to rehome and it was totally dominating the family. She knew that one day it would do really serious damage to a child.

These dogs are working dogs and thrive on excitement and movement. Children (no matter how well behaved) run around screaming and playing. Collies want to stop them and will always revert to using their teeth.

[kita1]

Secondly, you may not like Lankeela's reply to you, but she was only saying what a lot of responsible behaviourists and trainers will tell you.

Lankeela is very well respected on this site and I know for a fact that she is very knowledgeable about dog training, showing and behaviour. You may well choose to ignore her answers in the future (thats your loss) but telling her to move to another list is inexcusible. This site would be very much the poorer if she did not give her time to reply to so many answers - don't forget we get nothing out of this, just the fact that we can help people and dogs.

[carostarlite]

Thankyou, Kita for the reply it was very helpful and after our assessment this week we will make a decision.I did not object so much to the advice from Lankeela but the personal comments on our ability to keep a dog .We do not beat smack or yell at our dogs and if we tie them up and hold the dogs muzzle (for a couple of seconds) when it has bitten then so be it ,we are at a loss to know how to stop the behaviour and that is why we asked for advice.The list is for everyone to use and I feel very strongly about personal attacks, there is no place for them on a list but if you do attack someone, you have to expect it back.

[eyeshade]

Just seen these, caro, they are I am afraid right, sorry - collies are working dogs, although 1000's of people have them and find them to be fine but personally I would not rescue a collie.
Suggestion - you ALL have to be firm with him when he does things like this, it will be no good if one or several of the household giggle or reward him when he does it, someone needs to be firm to begin with and tell him "NO". If he responds well, give him a titbit. Gradually all try it until he gets the message. You have a lot of work on your hands and I think if you work hard, you could possibly turn him around but everyone has to pull together and work hard at it. Make sure your GS doesn't get left out in the process! If you feel you need a bit of extra help, you can always find a dog handler through your local vets or yellow pages, or try the internet. It would be nice, a year from now to sit back and say "just think, we nearly got rid of him" but you have comitted to him now so do try hard. ES

[doglady2]

Hi,unfortunatly you DO have a problem dont you.
I am afraid there are a few things i agree on with ref to some of your answers.The shame of all this is you obviously do love your dogs....but as you allready had one male and children............maybe you should of either got a female of just stuck to one dog.As you have children your dog would never got bored with nothing to play with .
Also......the fact is cross collie's are still frantic for work and loads of stimulation and YES they are reknown for control and nipping if they can get away with it.As you have visitors with children and you say this dog cant be trusted....the very best thing for your children and the dog would be maybe to look for someone who has no children and no other dogs.there are people out there that would love a challenge dog!
Its a shame for the familly and the dog but it may be the very best option you have................otherwise if this dog cant be helped then it will only have one more option and we all know what that is.Hope you get help and sort this sad problem out.Regards.

[carostarlite]

Hi doglady thanks for your reply ,we are having the dog behaviourist over tommorow (he is very well booked) but I just wanted to say that although this dog has nipped children it is some adults and my teenage sons friends that he barks and snaps at if we are not quick enough to restrain him.When I walked him today he saw a man in a hat and growled and barked ferociously, who knows what he sees .
I have talked to the humane society since my last posting and they feel they will only place the dog again if the behavourist thinks hes worth working with.We would prefer to keep him if possible.

[doglady2]

Hi,how have you got on?Regards