Rules of language

[justlearning]

I cannot remember the rule but hope that someone else will. When should we use the word "fewer" instead of "less" It feels wrong to say e.g. less people, less books, less parking spaces. I tend to say, fewer people, fewer books and fewer spaces and when asked why, I am unable to explain a manner of speech which I learned at school.

[bednobs]

i think its fewer if its a number. Ie in your example "fewr parking spaces" there is a number of parking spaces, and now there are less of them to enumerate. If for example you were talking about custard powder you would say "less custard powder" but "fewer tins of custard powder" because the tins are an actual number amount

[~max~]

That is the way I've learned it, Bednobs.
Fewer for quantifiable things (ie, things you can count individually, like people, trees, books..You can have one of them, or more.)
Less for unquantifiable things (ie, things you cannot count individually, like soup, air, water....You cannot have one of them)

[novalis]

Fewer plural.
Less singular.

[justlearning]

Aha, the light has dawned! Many thanks to both of you. It's been a long time since school :-)

[justlearning]

and if anyone from the Beeb is watching, please take note of my learned friends and endeavour to update some of your presenters.

[factor-fiction]

Good answers. But whI wonder why we have two choices here when for the opposite the word 'more' is always correct?

[Myriad2112]

http://englishplus.com/grammar/00000214.htm

[justlearning]

Thank you all so much for your time and interest :-) Myriad, your reference was most helpful and a printed copy is now hanging inside my computer cabinet. This has been a case of retaining a principle and forgetting the origin. (With A level English Literature and a degree level vocation she slinks away shame faced into the sunset. :-)

[Buenchico]

So you've studied Eng. Lit? Well that explains why you're struggling with the finer points of the English language :-)

The mathematicians among us think in terms of continuous and discrete variables. Discrete variables are ones that can be counted in distinct units (1, 2, 3 etc). Continuous variables can take any value (such as 1.367832, pi, or the square root of 2). Discrete variables use 'fewer'. (e.g. "fewer students", since you can't have a fraction of a student), whereas continuous variables use 'less'. (e.g. "less alcohol", since alcohol is not measured in discrete units).

When I was teaching, it was well known that you never asked the English staff to spell anything, or to work with the finer points of grammar. (Those areas were best left to the mathematicians).

Conversely, you never asked the maths teachers to add up. (We're great with complex algebra but rubbish with simple arithmetic!). Arithmetic was always a job for the English teachers ;-)

Chris

[justlearning]

Thank you Chris, for the definitive answer and for summing up in a nutshell, my educational aptitude :-) What a little gem of an explanation I can now offer to my family whilst I gently correct their misuse of fewer. Now...............how do I become a maths teacher...........mmmmmmmmmm :-)

[factor-fiction]

Good answer Buenchico. For a mathematician your English is very good, but as a fellow mathematician I noticed that you missed one of the finer points of the English language too: you put a full stop outside the brackets when it should have been inside when you wrote
"(Those areas were best left to the mathematicians). "

[Bert]

I agree with what has already been written, and I know that this distinction is brought into play at the supermarket checkouts where the sign over the fast till say "5 items or less", but it should say "5 items or fewer".
However, what do mathematicians call the symbol to the right of M on the conventional computer keyboard? And how would a mathematician (or anyone else who understands the meaning of the symbol) read the expression: x<4? I suggest that we would say "x is less than 4" even when x is a discrete variable.

[Tim123]

Bert,

I'd call it a comma.