grammer?

[joker]

We are having a discussion in the office and which of these is correct?

1. As if being the manager of the team was not enough.......
2. As if being the manager of the team were not enough.......

.....and why......?

[bernardo]

Number 2 "...were..." is correct because it is in the subjunctive mood, i.e. it is speculating about a hypothetical situation which might happen, rather than a real event.

 

If there were no distinction between the indicative and subjunctive moods, there should be little difficulty in differentiating the meaning anyway, but the use of the subjunctive adds more flavour and subtlety to the language.  If the subjunctive mood became defunct in the future, most people would hardly notice, except for us grammar-pedants.

[Octavius]

What about

3.  As if being the manager of the team is not enough...

?

[ICEMANSAV]

Grammar anyway not Grammer.

[joker]

bernardo, many thanks.

icemansav, you're absolutely right. Can't believe I misspelt it.

octavious, what?!?

[bernardo]

Octavius - "As if being the manager of the team is not enough..." is wrong; it should be "As if being the manager of the team were not enough..." because "were" is the subjunctive of the verb to be in the present tense (not just the past tense).

[Quizmonster]

Actually, it depends entirely on whether the situation is hypothetical or not.

If the person speaking the words suggested actually is the manager, then the indicative, not the subjunctive mood of the verb is perfectly appropriate. He might say: "As if being the manager of the team was not enough, the management now want me to be the physiotherapist as well!"

Should both jobs be being offered to him simultaneously, when he currently holds neither, then he ought to say: "As if being the manager of the team were not enough, the management want me to be the physiotherapist as well."

Therefore, it hangs entirely on the actuality or hypotheticality of the situation.

[Dark Angel]

Quizmonster, have you done a English Language Teaching course, or are you just very good in your grammar in general? You are very precise in your explanations, which is great.

I've done a course in TESOL but I need to refer my books first before I can explain these.

[ah9815]

Quizmonster is entirely correct. Sorry bernardo, it seems even grammar pedants can get it wrong! ;-)

[Quizmonster]

Dear Dark Angel, the answers to your dual question are 'Yes' and 'Yes'. I have a Master's degree in English, a teaching qualification and I spent half of my working life teaching the subject...though I'm now retired. Thank you for your kind comment. Cheers

[ah9815]

To Quizmonster: One thing just struck my mind about your answer:

In saying "was not enough" is one not referring to the past. Could one, as Octavius said, also say "is not enough" when referring to one's present situation? Would that not make "was" incorrect?

Answer would be greatly appreciated!

[Quizmonster]

Yes, Ah, the 'is' format is certainly possible. However, when using the 'as if' structure, the usual implication is that one is referring to something that already exists - ie started to exist in the past - in relation to some new thing/circumstance which complicates matters. Hence, "As if A wasn't enough, along comes B to add to my problems!" is the more usual way of expressing the idea.

[IndieSinger]

I know what slimfandango was talking about. I laughed out loud, but I'm not sure there was any relevence to the thread... S/he was paraphrasing the Comic Relief episode of The Office.

[ah9815]

It was: 'Do it yourself! I gotta go and save some Africans!'

[marmaduke]

Joker - they are both correct. They are both in use, so neither is 'better' than the other. The prescriptive rule is that 'as if ... was' is not correct, but since both are used without thinking in speech, there is actually no problem with 'was'.

[Quizmonster]

Dear Marmaduke, there is no such rule - prescriptive or otherwise - as you describe. Here's part of what that venerable old guide to good English - Fowler's 'Modern English Usage' - has to say about 'as if' structures. It refers to the subjunctive singular 'were' form and then continues:

"But when uncertainty or hypothesis is less obviously present or not present at all, the indicative form 'was' should be used."

If there is any rule...that's it! As I said in my earlier response, the use of 'were' or 'was' in 'as if' statements depends entirely on whether there is any hypothetical element and not on anything else. End of story.

 

Of course, if you are American, things may be different. However, as this is a British website, my answer is based on what applies in British English.