MP3 portable players

[pagey3]

Ok - so having established that IPods aren't all that, what's the general opinion on Rio Karma (20gb) or the iRiver H140?  Any really bad reviews on either?  What is a decent size memory - 20gb will hold a few thousand songs is that right?

[Kerplunk]

I have a Creative Nomad Zen Ultra thingy with 40gb storage.  I have found it to be very easy to use and the interaction between Jukebox and computer is excellent.  An average mp3 song (Approx 4mins) will be around 4 - 5mb in size, dependant on quality. So a 20gb hd will store approx. 4000 songs.

[fly258]

I would go for the iRiver, mainly because the wizards at RockBox http://www.rockbox.org/ look like they will be making thier magic available for it in the near future.

And when they do, it will blow the sox off  the rest of them.

The easiest way to work out how much music you can fit on a paticular MP3 player,  as a rule of thumb,

one minute of music equates to one meg of storage space