Cleo growling...

[wiggal]

Hey all!

Hope everyone is well :)

Now as some of you know, we got Cleo a few months ago, she as born 9/12/07. She is a lovely little girl, sleeps on my pillow and is always up to mischief lol!
Every so often we put her food down, and when she starts eating, I put my hand near her bowl or as if to touch her food. She has always been fine, until just now, went to test it and she started growling at me! My partner then tried and he did the same to her. We tried again and she then kept her nose in her bowl, but not eating, growled abit, and then yapped at us!

Is there any way we can stop her being like this?
She is a very very loving girl at all other times, and we were quite shocked at this as it is very much out of character
Our other dog shows no sort of growling or anything over his food, and can quite happily have cats or cleo eating out of his bowl at the same time as him!
Can we try and prevent it, as she is always fed seperately to Ashke, but there is always a chance of cats walking near her food, especially if she doesnt eat it all in one go! Or is it best to leave her to it and if a cat gets in the way, hope for the best!?

Ta :) xxx

[alfieblue]

Hi! Sorry to hear about the eating prob.

I have kept dogs all my life, but am no expert by any means but reading thru your note - I think you pup has decided she is now leader of the pack! The food issue is a classic example. You have to confirm your higher position in the hierarchy.

Don't leave her to it because it needs to be nipped in the bud - else it will get worse. If she thinks she can get away with this behaviour it will carry on.

Im not sure letting her sleep on your pillow is a good idea, much as we love our pets, they still have to know their place - perhaps a cozy dog bed on the floor would be a better idea.
Another thought is not to leave uneaten food., while the problem is ongoing, especially with the other animals around. Some dogs are grazers and eat off and on, but in this case, i think once she has had her fill, then remove the bowl.

You have to let her know that you are the leader. There is loads more i could tell you but I hope this will help meanwhile. There are some good sites re this sort of problem - but im sure she will get over it in a few weeks. I guess she's just defending her food! Hopefully in a while you will be able to remove and replace the bowl without the growling and yapping.

If all else fails, there are some excellent dog training guys that will come to your house and help you resolve the prob.

Hope this is a little bit of help. She sounds quite a character! Good luck x

[kita1]

What she is doing is perfectly normal and is called resource guarding.

If you try and take her food off her, punish her etc. the behaviour could well escalate.

The simple way of dealing with this is when you feed her let her start to eat - then get a really tasty treat (something she really loves), show her the treat - when her head is away from the bowl put the treat in the bowl. Now she sees that when your hand is near the bowl she is getting something really good.

This article explains it in more detail:

http://ahimsadogtraining.com/blog/resource-gua rding/

[alfieblue]

I dont agree that it is normal! But it sometimes happens! But can be rectified. Your suggestion of treats is a good idea, but the doggy still has to know its place, and that is not top dog! The other dog has no problem with feeding, There should be no aggression with feeding times.wiggal I hope all works out - shouldn't take long, then harmony will reign with cats n dogs. :o)

[wiggal]

Heya Alfieblue and Kita :)

Thanks for your replies, will certainly give your suggestions a go and see how it works.

These days theres never any food left in her bowl after a couple of minutes. She used to sometimes leave her food, and it seems to have been when she had sneaked upstairs and helped herself to some cat poo from the litter tray and eaten that, but now we have moved the baby gate, she can only get upstairs with us when we go to bed.

She doesnt sleep all night on my pillow, she is very good and sleeps by my feet all night and in the morning as soon as she knows I'm awake will come and snuggle up for a cuddle! She has many beds, (I bought her 3 in the first 3 weeks we had her!) only to find she prefered sleeping on the foot rest.

She is very good in all otherways really, she seems to know the rules. Like she is allowed on the sofa for a cuddle, but only when she is invited and that is when she is sleepy for a cuddle, and not bouncing around like a loon!

I have to go out now, off to Milton Keynes for an indoor skydiving experience! Yaaay!!

But I will be back later to check! :)

Ta xxx

[alfieblue]

Hi wiggal! Good to hear from you, have gr8 time with the skydiving thing!!!

I also have baby gates!!! Doggy sleeps in my room but not allowed upstairs till sleep time!!! He's fairly young and my son is doing animation and illustration. Imagine the scene if doggy got into his room!!!! Instant trash moment!!!! All that lovely art work redesigned by dog!!!! Also daughters room + spare room with hamsters in!!!! Thru the night he is brill, just gets his head down and gets quality sleep time in my room - have got his bed and various blankets in there which seems to suit him fine.

He is a lovely companion, we have a lot of fun with him but the sofa thing is a problem and we are working on it!!!! He has 3 comfy beds downstairs yet still he will get up on sofas - makes himself very comfortable!!!! He will get off when told but, as soon as my back is turned he sneaks back on and starts sending up the zzzzz's!!!!

What a character and a complete loopy loo but we love him to bits!!!!

Oh yes, he is also a little tealeaf!!!! Will steal socks n underwear from laundry basket if he can!!!! We have managed to curb that by not leaving anything lying around, including shoes, trainers, wellies, etc etc etc!!!! What a mega way of getting kids to tidy up!!!!! We are missing a few items so guess he has a secret stash in the garden - buried doggy
treasure!!!!

Fun pets though! He has such a lovely nature, like yours -
just got to convince him that he is a doggy and sofas and personal possessions are a no no!!!!

Best wishes :o)

[kita1]

This is taken from the article I gave:

"The technical term for this behavior is Resource Guarding, and it�s an absolutely normal dog behavior. However, it�s not something we humans appreciate. Fortunately, resource guarding is also a behavior that we can change."


All dogs will resource guard at some times in their life, therefore it is perfectly normal.

The pup is not trying to be 'top dog' (how on earth would a six month old pup try to be leader of a pack!). There is no such thing as 'top dog' or Alpha, the leader of a pack of wolves (and dogs are not wolves) constantly changes according to what the pack is doing at the time.

Besides this way of training has been proven to be based on flawed studies of captive wolf packs. If you really want to know how wolves behave then read this by Mech who studied wild wolf packs for many years.

http://www.4pawsu.com/267alphastatus_english.p df

[alfieblue]

Hi Kita1!!!!

Have read your post with interest!!!

Logged on to your chosen web site - american/canadian!!!
I have nothing against that - it was somewhat interesting but to quote it word for word!!!!

We are talking family pet dogs here - not flipping wolves!!!!

I have nothing against wolves, I am an animal lover but please ......

And yes - pups can rule the roost!!! Thankfully my dog in no way resembles a wolf in temperment, looks, or any other way.

Actually, take that back - he loves a howl in the morning when we play with squeaky bone!!!!! Does that count!!!! Or is he now classed as a wolf!!!?

[kita1]

Hi wiggal,

Think this may be what has happened:

You thought your dog was being fussy about food, therefore you (rightly) put the food down and when she did not eat it within a reasonable time you took the bowl up and put it away. She did not mind this as she was full (from the cat poo!) and the food was not important. BUT what she did learn was that you took the food away.

Now she is hungry as she has no access to other food. Now you approach the bowl and she thinks that you are going to remove it! So she does what any normal hungry animal will do and tells you to bog off!!

What you have to do is get her to associate you approaching the bowl with something nice happening (like something really tasty being added).

I don't think she will object to the cats approaching as they have never taken her food away - anyhow most cats I know will give her a run for her money!!!

We used to have a cat when I was young that used to go over next door and eat out of their GSD's bowl - the GSD used to stand back and watch it! My mum was always terrified the dog would kill it! The cat just waltzed away when it had had its fill and allowed the dog to finish its dinner!

[alfieblue]

sorry! dont agree with that!!! Read the post! I have had lovely pets since i was a nipper! i am now 53, i don't go with the wolf thing!!!! I use common sense and a love for my pets; wiggal, i hpe you get things sorted, no worries - enjoy your pets, all will be well. Have fun with them and enjoy. The food issue will soon pass. :o)

[lankeela]

This will not get better on its own, it will get worse. What will happen if she gets hold of something she should not eat, how will you be able to take it away from her? What if a child is around and tries to go near her when she has something to eat or play with, can you guarantee she will not bite the child?

You must deal with this now. Put her on a lead when she is eating. If she growls when you approach the bowl then pull her away from the bowl with the lead. Remove the bowl.
Tell her 'no' in a very firm voice. Replace the bowl after a few minutes and repeat if she growls. When she eats and lets you approach without growling praise her and let her eat. You can also do this with treats and bones, etc. only allowing her to have them if she is willing for you to touch them or take them away. Try holding a bone or chew and letting her eat it while you are holding the other end. At the first sign of any dissent then remove it.

If you don't stop this now, you will end up with a dog that rules you, and you won't be able to do anything with her.

And alfieblue, don't know where you get your ideas from but they are definitely not going to help in this case.

[alfieblue]

Thanks for your input Kita1. I guess we have different o pinions, but whatever - so long as wiggal takes it on, and gets a result one way or another!! They sound lovely. Enjoyed hearing from you - take care :o)

[alfieblue]

Hi lanleela! Sorry that you are taking this approach!!!
I only gave a few tips - i am sure the family can deal with those, and those of kita1!!! I am a responsible dog owner!!!!!! Kita1 and i have sent our comments but no way was any mention of an aggressive dog!!!!

Think you are going over the top with your post!!!! The dog does not need to be tethered to eat, and im sure will not be any problem with a child etc!!!! For goodness sake - get a grip!!!

[wolf63]

I think that it is easy to forget that the little 'people' that we live with are not human and don't think like us.

For a dog to growl over food seems to be a minor problem, but it is basically a sign that something is wrong.

Down to wolf/dog way of thinking - a dog should be a much lower member of the household than all the humans. If it is growling at any family member this means that it is not only guarding its food but it feels senior enough in the pack hierarchy to challenge a dominant member over possession of food.

It may come to nothing and this may be a quirk in the dogs nature - but who knows when you may accidentally put your hand near the bowl and be bitten.

I think that Wiggal's concern is real and justified.

Good luck in solving it - I am weak and not able to even stand up to my cats' demands. They take the p**s and order me around. I am at the bottom of the pack.

:-)

[alfieblue]

Thank you Wolf63 - I agree with you and you did make me laugh with your comment at the bottom of your post re your cat!!!

Im sure they will get it sorted. Its sounds such a lovable dog - they have just hit a bit of a blip! It will get sorted.

As for my pup - yes, i think he reckons he is top dog, thoroughly spoiled!! He can (or tries) to wrap me round his little paws! He sees my son as a playboy in the nicest sense - my son is the one that will play football etc with the dog, out all the time having loadsa fun.

My daughter is the groomer and calming influence - dog loves her attention.

Me? im just mum, walkies, giving the doggy dinner etc - and having loadsa cuddles.

I am sure i am also seen as the weakest link in my dogs eyes!!! Still love him tho - little wotsit!!!!! :o)

[gallapunk]

I agree totally with alfieblue and lankeela: it is a dominance thing and it must be stopped. Your dog will be happier for learning the rules, so you are not being cruel to teach her them. Good luck.

[showcatbenga]

I too agree totally with lankeela. If more people thought about the coulds & maybes there wouldn't be so many people bitten or savaged by out of control dogs. What is cute or amusing now probably won't be when pup grows up & no 'parent' wants their 'child' to become a deliquent! 'The dog whisperer' (sky3) has a good common sense approach or if you prefer an 'English' version try 'it's me or the dog' (more4).

[alfieblue]

I do agree with you showcatbenga. Our pup was attacked by two jack russells when out walking. Our pup was on the lead, the two dogs in question were not. The owners couldn't have given a damn! Luckily another couple came to our rescue - their dog had also been terrorised by the dogs just before it happened to us. My daughter and I were horrified - it could have been a toddler etc etc. Why are some dog owners so like that??

It has taken us quite a time to get the pups confidence back when out walking.

However, i do think that yes, the growling has to be nipped in the bud and im sure wiggal and her lovely pup will get it sorted. A lot of patience, kindness (which they ob have an abundance of) and training should do the trick.Wiggal - if you are reading this - let us know how you get on. :o)

[Kleiber]

I was reading this post & thinking, "Oh, boy, here we go again!" and then I got to lankeela's very sensible answer - can I just say a big THANK YOU, lankeela - I got into trouble from some people for daring to suggest the same thing some time ago, on another post. Wiggal - take lankeela's advice & take no notice of the way they do things across the pond (no offence intended to our cousins over there!). Good luck.