nspcc

[Flanker8]

I have just found out that the NSPCC is backing a total ban on smacking, and have therfore cancelled my monthly donation.

 

Anybody any ideas where my donation can go? I'm after a kids charity that benefits UK kids only.

 

I understand the need for legislation on abuse, and I'd rather avoid smacking if I can, but nobody is going to tell me that I can't discipline my child with a smack on the back of the hand/back of the legs if I see fit.

[tracymort]

Actually i think most of us do have great parenting skills when baby pops out.  trouble is crap books, tv programmes and bad advice from others interferes and we lose our skills.  They are called instincts and they work for me.  Something in me tells me it's wrong to smack a child so i listen and don't!  Our society however tells us to ignore our instincts and it doens't work then. 

Spare the rod spoil the child  thats absurd!  So by not hitting my boys i'm spoiling them.  Well consider them spoilt, happy, loved and secure then!  As a parent i'd never wnat my children to feel pain, obviously some is inavoidable but i certainly wouldn't be the one to inflict it on them.  I'm supposed to protect them from it.  Yes even a little "tap" will hurt a child, may not physically hurt for long but it will certainly confuse the child who looks up to you and depends on you.

 You can't spoil children by loving and respecting them  You can spoil them by buying them everything they want however.  Since when has love spoilt anyone?

[Oneeyedvic]

Bernardo - just curious and a non repetitive question -

 

1) Do you know right from wrong as an adult

2) Are you a mature adult contributing to society and not breaking the majority of laws in this country

3) Do you use your fists / get into fights a lot.

 

Whilst you may suprise me with your answer, I would sasume that the answers would be Yes, No and No. So your childhood has taught you right from wrong (or at least the same as most people over 30 who were smacked).

 

It has not turned you into a bully and has not taught you that hitting other peopel is right?

 

Slighlty confused - most people over 30 would have been smacked as a child - most people I know over 30 are parents - none of them think that fighting people are right.

Since the 70s/80s when discipline levels fell (ie schools and even the police could no longer give out 'clips round th ear') the levels of crimes comitted by children has increased - but I am sure ther is no correlation - lets have a group talk about it though and go hug some tree ;-)

 

Merry Christmas one and all!

[Weaza_cfc]

I am afraid i havn't read all the answers *too many!* so I will just answer as i see fit.

I am a child *no matter how much i deny it*. I am one of those who can be smacked *for now, anyway*. yet i still agree with you Flanker. My parents don't smack me now, they don't need to. But they did, albeit very rarely, when i was little. I didn't care if my rents shouted at me. Atleast if i got a little smack i definitely did not want to do whatever i was doing again.

There is a big difference between abusing your child and giving them the very odd smack. Besides, if the majority think of the smacks given to you when you were little, did it do you any harm? can you even remember it? When you were told off and smacked on the hand, did you run, tears streaming to the nearest phone box *violins please* and phone the NSPCC? err, no. You probably sulked for half an hour. i was given the odd smack. I havn't turned into a bully, i'm not emotionally scarred, i don't hate my parents.

If a stranger came up to me and smacked me, as most parents would smack a child, in the street, would i care? No. I would be startled, yes, hurt? No. i

This is the pc brigade run amok. Next it will be "you cannot shout at a child to discipline them, as you may be damaging them mentally and emotionally". Sob!

[Weaza_cfc]

Ooh, p.s. How about childline?!

Merry X-mas!

[Mr.Ix]

How do the NSPCC propose that a total ban be enforced? If a total ban is introduced I can guarantee that the courts of this country will be clogged up with cases that should never have been. eg. A GP, Family friend,nursery worker, notices that a child has a bruise on their arm. It was due to the child falling over perfectly innocently yet the person above suspects it may be due to a smack. Reports the parents. Unnneccessary stress and trauma is put on the family for no reason. I am a 28 year old father with an 18 month old son. I have smacked him. I didn't like doing it one bit. I am not however sorry I did it because I firmly believe that it was justified. As a poster said earlier, I think if a child is dooing something that is putting himself or others in danger , then no amount of reasoning, distraction, taking away of toys will get the message through. How can you reason with a child you can only comprehend the words, Dinner, Bed, Mummy, Daddy, hat etc? You can't possibly, and frankly I am not prepared to take the risk with my sons life when I know that a sharp tap in the hand , along with firm verbal admonishment, will get the message through

[Mr.Ix]

Continued, I believe that a smack is the ultimate in last resorts. It should not be used with emotion and it should cause the parent more pain. If we want to get all biological about it, we are all animals. Parents in the animal kingdom don't try and reason with their young if they are putting their lives at risk. Children do need to learn dicipline at a very early age and smacking is a last resort but I believe necessary part of it. To the posters who have said they have well balanced and respectful children who were never smacked., I applaud your results but not every child is the same. My nephew is 3 years old and is naturally mischevious and naughty. His mother is an advocate against any smacking and he is I'm sorry to say a nightmare and I am surprised he is still alive due to the number of times he has run off into the road, put his hands in electical sockets, fires, pulled glass vases off window sills etc. He gets talked to about it aftert but repeatedly does it laughing all the way. My son has only ever been smacked when he has done something that could cause him serious injury or death. He has never done it a second time and each smack administered has caused tears more from shock than from actual pain as the tears dry up very quickly but the message stays. A child can equate the smack to the deed, it is a natural survival insticnct that all animals have.

[Mr.Ix]

And I am not saying all children are little more than animals in case anyone leaps on that point.

[tracymort]

Some interesting reading http://www.wwwave.org/Preventing_Violence/Use_the_rod.htm

http://www.wwwave.org/Preventing_Violence/Effects_of_Smacking.htm

[jimmer]

right for the last time this is not about the parents right to smack its about childrens rights under law. Children should have the same protection under the law as adults. if you tap someone in the way you describe, then while technically an assult, do you think the police would want anything to do with it? no. if all that was going on was reasoned well balanced parents using a little prod as a last resort, do you think the nspcc would get involved? no. please don't take a news story to the nth degree and so literally. Imagine for a moment that you are trying to convict an abuser in court. the acussed claims reasonable chastisement. with no witnesses and without this law the child could stay at risk. the law makes it easier to prosecute abusers. we are all criminalised on the margin ( speeding mentioned alot) it doesn't really effect how we live but it does provide a bit of protection for pedestrians and other road users. look outside your cozy world, its not all about a little tap for tarquin coz he's naughty. some people don't know where these limits are, and they get off coz the law doesn't protect children.

merry christmas

jim 

[Oneeyedvic]

I am sorry Jimner but you have just defeated your own arguments:

 

At the moment, the law does offer protection against abuse against children. If the law were to change to outlaw all 'abuse' and include smacking, all that will happen is that an overworked and understaffed team of Child Protection officers will have ten times the amount of cases to work from 'caring people in the community'. Do you really thinkthis will help.

 

Outlawaing smacking to give children 'rights' (and no children are not entitled to the same rights that adults are (eg voting/drinking/smoking etc)) is the equivalent of banning driving becasue some people speed, or outlawing drinking becasue some people drink to excess, or outlawing copulation becasue some people are raped.

 

"look outside your cozy world, its not all about a little tap for tarquin coz he's naughty. some people don't know where these limits are, and they get off coz the law doesn't protect children."  - The people who don't know the limits are not going to stop because of a change in legislation (eg drink driving) and the law does protect children against ABUSE.

 

And tracyh - interesting articles - and the proban campaign love to point at Sweden - but to compare us to other European countires is very dangerous - our whole ethos is different - take the amount of credit or the number of hoimes owned (I work in the finance industry) as classic examples of our differences.

 

And yes, some people did have abusive parents - but changing the law about smacking is not really going to change anything.

 

Merry Christmas

[bernardo]

Bernardo - just curious and a non repetitive question -

 

1) Do you know right from wrong as an adult

2) Are you a mature adult contributing to society and not breaking the majority of laws in this country

3) Do you use your fists / get into fights a lot.

 

1. Yes  2. Yes  3. No

 

What is your point?  I know the difference between right and wrong because it is intrinsic, intuitive, and obvious; not because I was smacked as a child.  If anything (in terms of "teaching right from wrong"), being smacked was counter-productive.

 

[stressed out]

It's easy for Bernardo to speak as he has admitted he is not a parent! Therefore he has no experience of having a child nagging, crying,smacking and screaming till they lose breath and going stiff in your arms making you feel like exploding! How is anyone expected to stay calm in that situation? Only a saint! It's easy to lose your cool and just "chastise" your child when they are doing something that they know is wrong and just want to pee you off! My 13 month old has that done to a T! Aswell as smacking me in the face because i pick him up to restrain his arms from touching/ doing something dangerous! I would not beat him but he does understand from a smack and if you think i'm a bad mother for disciplining my child then i'm in a no win situation! I carried him, gave birth and am raising him to want for nothing (Love, health and the necessaries!) but appreciate what little i can provide/afford! I was hit as a child and it has done nothing bad to my development, i learnt to be afraid of my father but respect him. I understand that everyone has their different views and description of smacking and that there are many degrees of discipline. As long as you don't beat a child or repeatedly smack them then i have nothing against a smack on the hand or over the nappy!

[ahar]

i bet there's a lot of disagreement here over what smacking is. i can vividly remember being smacked as a child, and i cannot remember being physically hurt. however, i do remember the sheer EMBARRASSMENT of it! especially in front of other relatives. that taught me not to misbehave. it was only ever a tap on the bum that didnt even smart. i do know that if my mum had just shouted or said "dont do that" i probably would have ignored her.