Ok this is a more real question from me.....

[The Sherman]

And porbably a very important one!
Was watching telly this morning and saw an advert saying I should respect all religion. First off I dont like being told what to do by the telly 2nd should I?

[naomi24]

Octavius, you should have been a politician - or at the very least a spin doctor. You can't half make 'em up.

Your comment wasn't confined to sales of ouija boards and the like - you actually said You seem to have followed a similar path, albeit perhaps without the amulets - and you're quite wrong.

Additionally, you've credited me with labels that I don't accept (why do you people need to 'label' everything and everyone? Is it because you, yourselves feel a desperate need to 'belong' and assume that everyone else does too?), and I've already explained my take on atheism, so I won't do it again - oh .....and no, I don't communicate with ghosts.

You're quick to accuse anyone who doesn't agree with you of demeaning religion, but the boot fits the other foot you know. Planks and eyes spring to mind. If my opinions don't suit you, that isn't my problem, so leave me and my beliefs out of this now. The question isn't about me.

[Octavius]

Naomi, it is not made up at all, and I by no means wish to categorise you with any labels, it just seems more often that you sit on the side of the atheist with Christianophobic / Islamaphobic tendencies. It is a case of making your bed and lying in it, isn�t it? Your attempt at deflection by making light of my remarks is rather charming.

Anyway, in regards to the Ouija board sentence. My inference was that many people who do reject established religion, tend to find another spiritual path rather than reject spiritualistic tendencies altogether. There are atheists here who reject all kinds of religio-spiritual beliefs. But you are not that type of atheist.

Jews, Christians and Muslims do thank and praise God for so many good things. Would I be right in saying that atheists have no one to thank, even when the impulse to do so is hurtling towards their lips?

So then if you wish to detract from your own spirituality - back to the Q. Do you respect religion? I guess you sit in the �no� camp.

[naomi24]

According to you I also seem to have followed a path of talking to ghosts and dabbling in ouija boards, and even though you now say that inference was aimed at others, it certainly didn't appear that way. You're like a dog with a pretty mouldy bone, Octavius. Nuff said.

(Incidentally, for your future reference, the only phobia I suffer from is arachnophobia).

Now let's get back to the question.

[Octavius]

Well I did try to do that, but you ignored the question.

My post about your communication with ghosts was a question, I did not presume you use anything for this but you seem to have implied I did. I thought you personally saw a ghost walking around your house. Is that not broadly classed as �communication�?

I have an inquisitive and open mind. If you visualise this as me being a dog chewing on an old bone, then perhaps I should refrain from showing any interest in your perceived spiritual beliefs, lest you feel I am placing unquestionable burden upon your goodself to explain them to me. I imagine you will mutually feel the same about my Christianity.

[naomi24]

Octavius, Wrong again. I didn't ignore the question. This from yesterday.

Everyone has a personal right to believe as they will, and I respect that, but I don't respect it when they bludgeon others with their religion, or when their beliefs adversely affect others.

Now be done with it for goodness sake. You just want an argument, so do us all a favour - go and argue with someone else because this is becoming incredibly monotonous. I've said all I've got to say on the subject of 'me'.

[123everton]

You don't believe in God, but then you talk about your God, you're not an atheist, you have had spiritual experiences, but you're not a spiritualist, you believe in ghosts and by point of fact you know they exist, but personal experience is not proof, but you don't need someone else to tell you what to believe or how to interpret your events, truth can only be found in verifiable scientific proof, but if you don't agree with it then you say it's just your opinion, aliens helped form the genesis of creation and all of this is more logical than any other idea, the only thing that surpasses your disbelief in anything is your ability to express your disbelief in everything, if you could just face roughy one way, if you could after one of your polemics of contrariness care to divulge your belief/idea then at least the recipient of your wisdom has something to contemplate or reject. That is a fair exchange of views, is it not?
You talk in riddles, you flip flop around going hell for leather on whichever way you're facing that day, you're ambiguity is legendary, I said it to you a long time ago you should be in politics but the only thing stopping you is you're ability to take a gate at any little sleight or percieved insult even when it's tongue in cheek.
I'd have said offence, but if you took offence you'd have nothing to sit on.

[Octavius]

Naomi, it is strange that you find talking about your own spirituality and beliefs monotonous, yet are able and content to continually mock Christianity in a monotonous way. It does seem rather unilateral that I can be challenged and questioned ad infinutum about my beliefs and asked to justify various things, yet you wish to sleek away from yours.

Nonetheless, I seem to have unintentionally hit a nerve, so I will leave you be.

[naomi24]

My, my, you boys do have your knickers in a knot - and all for nothing - as usual. I really don't know why you're so fascinated with my beliefs, but fascinated (or perhaps aggravated) you seem to be, because this unpleasantness occurs every time I meet up with either of you. Oh well, just another of life's little mysteries I suppose.

Everton, for one who claims that I talk in riddles, the obvious recipient of my wisdom (aka you) seems to know an awful lot about my philosophy, so you've clearly been paying attention. Have a gold star. However, your apparent inability to comprehend anything that falls beyond the scope of your own belief appears to be your sticking point. On second thoughts, make that a silver star. Must try harder!

Octavius, It isn't talking about my beliefs that I find monotonous - it's your constant unnecessary argumentative babble. I've no objection to answering questions, which I've done, but since then, despite telling you several times that this thread isn't about me, you've persisted. Octavius, old chap, I think it's pretty clear that it isn't my nerves that are smarting. Keep taking the tablets. ;o)

[Octavius]

Ah naomi, your traditional and cyclical �you are a child/senile old fool� denouement.

How things never change eh.

[naomi24]

Can't see any of that written here Octavius. Oops - watch out - you're spinning again.

[123everton]

My knickers are neither knotted nor frayed, I am however perplexed, all the statements I've listed are true and accurate, ans afor answering questions you have'nt answered mine (look for the question mark) as for the scope of my understanding it is wideranging I'm happy to espouse your doctrine as being right for you if only you'd state with some attempt at clarity what it is (other than some woolly notions and soundbites) I'm more than happy to respect the validity of others belief, my future wife is a Buddhist, I agree with K90 from time to time and we none of us 3 share the same God, I've even been known to promote the views of Hinduism a religion I don't ahere to either.
Thankyou for all the stars (of whatever hue) tell me, are these stars the ones your aliens are from?
Oh to be so logical, c'est la vie.....

[naomi24]

Everton, oh dear. You are scraping the barrel. And this from a man who claims he respects other people's beliefs. Doesn't quite gel somehow, does it? Never mind.

Why ask what my doctrine is? You've already outlined my beliefs, and since you already know that my notions are woolly, you must also know what my answers to your questions would be, so there's little point in you asking, and there's even less point in me bothering to answer. Complete waste of time in my view.

By the way, this may come as a bit of a shock to you, but the god that you and Keyplus worship are one and the same. You just have different names for him. You call him God - Keyplus calls him Allah. Just thought I'd mention that.

[Octavius]

Naomi, I think the lines �you have been paying attention, have a silver star, must try harder� clearly denote a patronising attitude towards a child, and the lines �old chap, keep taking the tablets� clearly denote a patronising attitude towards a senile fool.

Both counts are devoid of spin. By implication and your disdainful attempts at derision, my assessment was perfectly accurate.

Perhaps you should just stick to fawning �here here� and �well said� type comments when you feel you want to belong to a gang.

[naomi24]

Octavius, for goodness sake, man, just put a sock in it!

[mibn2cweus]

just a video

[naomi24]

That's excellent mibs.

[123everton]

My vision of God is entirely different from K90 or Lonnie, it's that desire to play with words and oversimplify that stopped you getting that job in the U.N.
Who are "they"?
I'm often distrustful of people who use such ambiguties, Martin Luther King believd very much in God, look what it inspired him to do.

[Davethedog]

And being treated as a 2nd class citizen because of the colour of his skin had nothing to do with it.

Not only that its doubtful if you would ever of heard of him if it wasn't for Rosa Parks. It wasn't one man it was a movement of which because of his eloquence, he was the head.

[Octavius]

You could almost say the same about Jesus. Were it not for his disciples, Paul and Constantine......